Regional Airlines

[sonicsupervibe]

I am at a loss on how to set up and run a small regional airline, without constantly going bankrupt.  I try to use efficent planes on routes with no competition, in base cities that need service.  What is the point in having small planes or anything smaller then a class 5 airport in this version of the game?  Airway sim used to be fun to play, when you were able to run, with sucess regional route networks from anywhere on the planet.  Now it seems like the only airlines that have any success are the big boys, that grab the major hubs, and get in line early for the best that Boeing and Airbus have to offer.  Any suggestions?  Will version 1.3 be any different when it comes to giving regionals a little bit more favorable treatment? 

[Curse]

There are many threads featuring smaller/regional airlines.

Any suggestions?

Yeah. Instead of complaning 3/4 of the post just tell us where you started, what year ingame it was, what aircraft you used etc.

Will version 1.3 be any different when it comes to giving regionals a little bit more favorable treatment?

There's nothing announced till now that helps small and badly run airlines to survive.

[Pilot Oatmeal]

There's nothing announced till now that helps small and badly run airlines to survive.

I LOL'd at that bit, haha

[swiftus27]

Moo.

[DenisG]

As Curse has already pointed out, there have been a number of threads on the issue, with swiftus, Rushmore, and myself regularly testing the adjusted game engines on its impact on the 'regional', more specififc 'commuter' model.

https://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,31286.0.html

Currently, every regional business model with economic aircrafts with more than 35 seats works perfectly fine in aws. Below that pax size, there are still enormous difficulties to tackle.

Let us know which airline you fly, which routes and with what aircrafts, and we will quickly be able to tell you more details.

Cheers,
Denis

[sonicsupervibe]

then what is the point in having minor airports, and aircraft under 35 seats?

[Curse]

The same reason why there are ugly girls. To fill up the world and let it look busy.

No, seriusly, it's about future improvements in this segment like city based demand and sami is tweaking on smaller airlines a lot. So the status quo won't last forever.

On the other hand you can use smaller aircraft than 35 seats already - in Jet Age scenario for example or if you have other aircraft that generate profit you can subsidize small aircraft with them.

[DenisG]

With the development of aws, the main rush of interest has always been the creation of medium and big airlines. The problems resulting from this, e.g. routing (ABCBA vs. AB), bases, slot availability, used market availability, etc., have been the main focus of Sami's efforts during the past years. The regional model has worked well with those mentioned aircrafts and there have been a lot of people dedicated to this. The smaller airports below 20 pax demand have not been profitable so far with any aircraft available. As scenarios usually cover a long time-span over 15-20 years, demand grows. And there will be airports with little or no demand at the beginning of the 1980s that will grow into very attractive routes over the game years (China, India, Arabia, etc.). Therefore, these airports are available and will be flown sooner or later. Those airports that remain below the critical mark are usually not flown and many aws-users are hoping to make them profitable with changes on the upcoming game engine or so.

The main problem with making small routes with small aircrafts profitable from a system's point of view is that you need to tackle the underlying economic model of aws and there are many ways to do that, which will again result in different user behaviour. I think most of us have been very satisfied with the modification of slot availability and one challenge will be to keep slot hoggers from utilizing small aircrafts only to secure a market share at LHR.

Cheers,
Denis

[swiftus27]

Okay, the SHORT SHORT SHORT version on how to win.


1.  International Flights are amazingly lucrative
2.  Frequency (better to run 10 737s versus 3 A300s)
3.  Grab slots... while some say this is policed, it isn't unless you are truly stupid.
4.  Always fly 110-120% of demand to a single destination before you start going after others.  
5.  Keep your planes flying.  (Run as many flights per day)
5a.  Turboprops at ~300nm and less dominate.  Have these to grab slots and win frequency.
6.  Marketing isn't THAT important.  
7.  If you can afford the time, being an F5 demon is essential.

[Sami]

Did you know that running a good & profitable regional in real life is near-to-impossible also.  

Anyway; thanks to the test airlines made by the couple beforementioned users, I have a clue on what to tweak in order to make it easier. Handling costs and also a bit on staff costs.

[swiftus27]

Did you know that running a good & profitable regional in real life is near-to-impossible also.  

So NOW you inject realism!   

[DenisG]

The problem with your airline in DotM:
https://www.airwaysim.com/game/Info/Airline/1960/

- you fly F27s, so you are perfectly within the range of regional models that work fine
- your routes are way too long for props (Long Island MacArthur, Little Rock)
- the Miami route is totally overcrowded and a bad idea to start at

Cheers,
Denis

[Jona L.]

The same reason why there are ugly girls. To fill up the world and let it look busy.

LOL LOL LOL!!!!
Curse, you flamed

[DenisG]

How is Le Bourget doing, Jona? Many aircrafts on the ground, I heard so far...

Enjoy your stay.

Cheers,
Denis

[Jona L.]

How is Le Bourget doing, Jona? Many aircrafts on the ground, I heard so far...

Enjoy your stay.

Cheers,
Denis

I am not in the business days, only there on the public days to be exact Saturday only. Flying DUS-CDG Sat. Morning and return Sun. evening.
anyways: thanks

[sonicsupervibe]

Denis

F27s are the most cost efficient for the date that I am working with.  LIT and ISP had no coverage, and are now profitable!  I went down to 1 Miami fight per day, and am now competing with discounted fares, and am spoking out, or flying to the closest airports from MCO.  Let's see if this works!

Any thought given to creating a "regional only" game?  eliminate any planes larger then 75 capacity?

I appreciate everyone's feedback!

[DenisG]

Denis

F27s are the most cost efficient for the date that I am working with.  LIT and ISP had no coverage, and are now profitable!  I went down to 1 Miami fight per day, and am now competing with discounted fares, and am spoking out, or flying to the closest airports from MCO.  Let's see if this works!

Any thought given to creating a "regional only" game?  eliminate any planes larger then 75 capacity?

I appreciate everyone's feedback!

Hi sonic.

Yep, looks much better now. Try to win with frequency and take a look at our Brazilian fellow Guth (Guth Airways) at Frankfurt who has been setting up a similar business model. No need to fly discounts at this stage. The profit shown on the aircraft page is earnings after direct costs or some refer to it as gross margin, which doen not include your overhead, it may be green, but still may not provide sufficient cash for the balance sheet. I still recommend to drop the two long routes and use them on frequency at shorther routes. Try to fly each route on every week day, no need for one day rest. Fly e.g. Nassau with three dailies and you will have an advantage against the competitor there. But fly ing 1-1 is hard for a young airline.

Keep us updated.

Cheers,
Denis