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Author Topic: Bad cargo LF% on return flight  (Read 549 times)

Offline Ice50DK

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Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« on: February 10, 2018, 07:13:11 PM »
Hi everybody

I have a problem with the cargo LF% on the return flight for a
lot of my routes.. The flight out is full, but return is only between
5-15 %

I have tried lowering the prices on the return, but it does not seem
to do the trick.
Does anyone have a suggestion?

Best regards
Ice50DK

Offline Cardinal

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The person who likes this post:
Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2018, 07:26:12 PM »
Have you checked the demand on the return? The route planning page only shows one-way demand, not round trip. A handful of routes on the PAX side are asymmetrical for some reason, so there are probably a handful of Cargo routes that also have uneven demand.

Offline Talentz

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The person who likes this post:
Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2018, 07:33:44 PM »
Have you checked the demand on the return? The route planning page only shows one-way demand, not round trip. A handful of routes on the PAX side are asymmetrical for some reason, so there are probably a handful of Cargo routes that also have uneven demand.

Actually, there are alot more asymmetrical routes on the cargo side. Plus, demand is calculated differently and is based off an airport's catchment radius. Smaller airports may show large potential, but lack the catchment radius to reflect that actual demand.

Talentz
Co-founder and Managing member of: The Star Alliance Groupô - A beta era, multi-brand alliance.

Offline Ice50DK

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2018, 07:47:52 PM »
Okay, that made a lot of clarity to me..

Thanks for the answer, guys  :)

Offline reedme

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2018, 05:57:00 AM »
Actually, there are alot more asymmetrical routes on the cargo side. Plus, demand is calculated differently and is based off an airport's catchment radius. Smaller airports may show large potential, but lack the catchment radius to reflect that actual demand.

Talentz

I was under the impression that potential only shows what is currently inside that airports catchment and that the current demand adjusts as people supply space to the routes

And that if the airport size grew (which they donít at the moment ?) thatís when the potential could increase

Offline Talentz

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2018, 08:01:05 AM »
It's still abit gray as Sami hasn't laid out all the cards to tell. But, lets go through what is known:

I was under the impression that potential only shows what is currently inside that airports catchment and that the current demand adjusts as people supply space to the routes.

Potential demand is the max amount of cargo within the squares around the airport. Current demand reflects the amount of demand within the catchment area of the airport that can be moved. It generally starts at 10% of potential. It can then rise or fall as players serve the demand (or don't) serve it.

And that if the airport size grew (which they donít at the moment ?) thatís when the potential could increase

Airports do indeed grow or shrink. What your thinking about is Infrastructure class. It is currently not model to move past 5. Thus, the max catchment radius that can be achieved is Infra 5, traffic 10. Which is probably about 175km of the max 200km the system is designed.

Some points to go over:

1.) Does infrastructure level move? I've never seen it. An airport that starts at 4, has stayed at 4 as far as I can tell. This could be what Sami has said is not modeled ~

2.) Does Traffic level move? Oh yes, it does. Mainly, it goes down. I've seen airports that start 5 infra, 10 traffic drop to 5,9 or 5,8. I've seen airports rise from 5,9 to 5,10. But generally, I haven't come across an airport that started 5,8 go to 5,10.

3.) What does it take to raise traffic level? We don't know, but assume it has to be huge operations. Generally, one airline, can't move traffic level by itself. It requires multiple airlines.

So, this is why:

Plus, demand is calculated differently and is based off an airport's catchment radius. Smaller airports may show large potential, but lack the catchment radius to reflect that actual demand.
Hope that helps,

Talentz
Co-founder and Managing member of: The Star Alliance Groupô - A beta era, multi-brand alliance.

Offline reedme

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2018, 07:10:01 PM »
Okay so to summarise Potential shows the max catchment of the airfield and the current demand shows whatís achieved at current infra/traffic level ?

Offline reedme

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2018, 07:12:12 PM »
What I donít understand is that I can provide cargo services to an airport with not much current demand and it will grow to match the potential if there is no other cargo flights between the two city (not airport) pairs

So thatís why I thought potential showed the current catchment and current was a figure that showed the spread of that catchment between airports

Offline Talentz

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Re: Bad cargo LF% on return flight
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2018, 09:59:15 PM »
What I donít understand is that I can provide cargo services to an airport with not much current demand and it will grow to match the potential if there is no other cargo flights between the two city (not airport) pairs

So thatís why I thought potential showed the current catchment and current was a figure that showed the spread of that catchment between airports

Three questions to your example...

1.) Is potential demand a static number? I don't know and Sami hasn't answered that yet.

2.) Are the airport(s) of your example ones that have most of the development squares near the airport? So the squares past 100km hold little to no value (forest/desert/undeveloped) thus the potential demand can be reached easily.

3. Is the airport a special case like SIN or HKG. Where some geopolitical barrier exists that restricts a catchment's effectiveness?


There's alot of questions, we, the playerbase still don't know.


Talentz
Co-founder and Managing member of: The Star Alliance Groupô - A beta era, multi-brand alliance.

 

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