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Author Topic: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2  (Read 465 times)

Offline ZombieSlayer

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Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« on: February 07, 2018, 01:51:06 AM »
To take advantage of a production increase in the 733 line in GW2, I canceled and reordered my entire 737 order expecting deliveries from 1984 on. Orders are now scheduled as expected from March 1984, but beginning in 1988 there are huge gaps in my orders despite plenty of open delivery slots. My entire order was canceled before reordering, so it is my understanding this should not be the case.

If there is any way to fix this it would be greatly appreciated!

Edit: I am showing 250 733 on order still when I actually have 150. This is after day change, the on order list should have updated.
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Offline Sami

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2018, 06:52:53 AM »
If you cancel your order it does not automatically mean that a subsequent new order would be any earlier, or arranged like previous. So in no case it is ever recommended to cancel an order in order to get earlier production slots....

Offline ZombieSlayer

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2018, 11:12:21 AM »
Well, until a better launch order allocation is introduced we don't really have a choice....miss the launch by 2 hours, 2300 orders are in and first open delivery slot is 1993. Ra te increases in the middle of the night, miss early production slots and first delivery slot late 87 so you order. A few hours later another rate increase, have to cancel and reorder. It is that or wait 4 additional years for planes.

There have been multiple discussions about how to better handle launches here (24-48 hour wait period to assign alots, for example). It is time to make one of them happen.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2018, 11:32:09 AM by ZombieSlayer »
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Offline schro

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2018, 02:25:53 PM »
If you cancel your order it does not automatically mean that a subsequent new order would be any earlier, or arranged like previous. So in no case it is ever recommended to cancel an order in order to get earlier production slots....

Yet, if you can cancel and reorder to get planes 4 years earlier than you would have otherwise, when faced with the need for a yuge and fast fleet conversion.. every year counts. So I cancelled/reordered for this as well.  Such is life when running a.... small regional airline in LHR.

Online gazzz0x2z

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2018, 02:33:35 PM »
I think both of you don't get Sami's point of view : all the negative effects you see, he sees as positives, as it leaves more room for smaller companies to exist.

Offline schro

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2018, 03:02:44 PM »
I think both of you don't get Sami's point of view : all the negative effects you see, he sees as positives, as it leaves more room for smaller companies to exist.

I was contesting the carte blanche suggestion that there's never a valid reason to cancel and reorder by providing some valid rationale for such a practice.

The point ZombieSlayer is making is that when ordering planes, the system shouldn't skip over a year of empty production slots. There's still plenty of room for smaller companies to order that particular line of planes given the recent expansion of the production...

Offline ZombieSlayer

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2018, 03:10:35 PM »
I was contesting the carte blanche suggestion that there's never a valid reason to cancel and reorder by providing some valid rationale for such a practice.

The point ZombieSlayer is making is that when ordering planes, the system shouldn't skip over a year of empty production slots. There's still plenty of room for smaller companies to order that particular line of planes given the recent expansion of the production...

And especially in this case where assigning open production slots would have not taken extra slots as I already HAD deliverys schedule before the cancellation. Once the cancelled grayed out slots opened up the same number of delivery slots would have been available before and after the transaction.
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Online Zobelle

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2018, 07:21:30 PM »
I think both of you don't get Sami's point of view : all the negative effects you see, he sees as positives, as it leaves more room for smaller companies to exist.

Companies that will likely just bk anyway.
Itís okay plenty of resellers for max UM price. :D

Offline lpopa93

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2018, 08:45:29 AM »
I have a similar question about GW3. I think opening a new topic is not necessary. I tried to order some new aircraft, and the production line is almost completely free. Why do I have to wait 4 months until the first aircraft is delivered if so many slots are free? We are in January and the first aircraft would be delivered in April...

Offline Tha_Ape

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2018, 09:06:01 AM »
I have a similar question about GW3. I think opening a new topic is not necessary. I tried to order some new aircraft, and the production line is almost completely free. Why do I have to wait 4 months until the first aircraft is delivered if so many slots are free? We are in January and the first aircraft would be delivered in April...

This is normal. The aircrafts are not ready waiting for you in the manufacturers hanger with all your desired specs.

Online Zobelle

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2018, 02:59:37 PM »
I have a similar question about GW3. I think opening a new topic is not necessary. I tried to order some new aircraft, and the production line is almost completely free. Why do I have to wait 4 months until the first aircraft is delivered if so many slots are free? We are in January and the first aircraft would be delivered in April...

Personally I think that if you order an aircraft in default spec with absolutely no customization then you should get the first possible slot. Even if that slot is only two weeks away.

Offline Sami

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2018, 03:04:34 PM »
Personally I think that if you order an aircraft in default spec with absolutely no customization then you should get the first possible slot. Even if that slot is only two weeks away.

Do you really think the manufacturers with near-empty production books have ready made aircraft just sitting in the tarmac waiting if someone would possibly happen to order them. Even if it's the bog-down standard machine with no extras. No.

Even the 4 months is quite generous in some cases, but we assume the manufacturer has most parts in stock and it's down to the assembly, testing, etc. For large commercial airliners even the final acceptance phase of the airline takes more than two weeks....
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 03:07:39 PM by Sami »

Online Zobelle

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2018, 03:42:00 PM »
Do you really think the manufacturers with near-empty production books have ready made aircraft just sitting in the tarmac waiting if someone would possibly happen to order them. Even if it's the bog-down standard machine with no extras. No.

Even the 4 months is quite generous in some cases, but we assume the manufacturer has most parts in stock and it's down to the assembly, testing, etc. For large commercial airliners even the final acceptance phase of the airline takes more than two weeks....

Cancelled orders? Anything is possible. Okay so if thatís a no go, then letís talk about the in game robo-brokers.

As I understand it, those unused slots usually end up being broker purchases. Brokers who sometimes end up just parking the frame for months, years at a time before offering for sale. Why? Parked frames donít make money and it artificially tightens the market.

Instead those brokers should as a default turn the frames on UM immediately just as a player-broker would.

Offline wilian.souza2

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2018, 04:22:54 PM »
Changing the subject a little, why it isn't possible to buy an used aircraft by doing 2 partial payments, just like it's possible with new aircraft? I think if this was possible, we wouldn't be seeing such a wild race for new aircraft which drives up their price - I mean, except in cases when a new model is launched.

Online Zobelle

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2018, 04:44:38 PM »
Changing the subject a little, why it isn't possible to buy an used aircraft by doing 2 partial payments, just like it's possible with new aircraft? I think if this was possible, we wouldn't be seeing such a wild race for new aircraft which drives up their price - I mean, except in cases when a new model is launched.
Like financing?

Offline wilian.souza2

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2018, 02:25:12 AM »
No, just dividing the payment in 2... Could be like 50% at the purchase and 50% 1 month later. For larger aircraft we could divide the payment in more shares, like 3 or 4, all shares paid monthly.

Offline Talentz

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2018, 04:12:27 AM »
No, just dividing the payment in 2... Could be like 50% at the purchase and 50% 1 month later. For larger aircraft we could divide the payment in more shares, like 3 or 4, all shares paid monthly.

Still limited to 3 frames per ordering cycle. I don't see how it makes a difference. If you don't have the full cash up front and fully expect to be in the money upon delivery, just 1 yr lease and buy. If cash flow isn't that big of a deal, the extra money paid from breaking the lease (50% of 1 year) is really just a convince fee for your hording. 

Or my hording of UM aircraft  :laugh:


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Offline wilian.souza2

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2018, 10:41:22 AM »
Leasing is just a way of wasting money. It's useful for new airlines, fast expanion or if you need aircraft that no one wants to buy later, but I never saw a single lease and buy that would give you a financial advantage-especially buying during a leasing contract with an AI broker. Things are much worse when the new aircraft  is way above its launch price, like the popular ones.

Offline spiff23

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2018, 04:26:10 AM »
Couple commetnts.

I've always found in AWS that when you place the first 50 order and there are a lot of slots that you can get a good frequency of deliveries in the 2-3 range per month. However when you put in the next 50 it defaults you to 1 a month which is frustrating because it makes fleet transitions excruciating or risk that it will be even more excruciating if you wait,

I will say as an experienced player that the GW2 queues are just not working.  As noted, if you aren't wired on this thing 24x7 you are hopelessly behind on fleet cycles.  Even when playing, if you miss the announcement by 30 minutes you are already 5-6 years into the cycle and you then get screwed when the queue shrinks as a ton of slots open and you are still stuck a few years out.   My suggestion on a fix if this weird initial 10 deliveries a month thing is going to be a new standard is to actually collapse the queue of existing players as orders build in sequence.  There shouldn't be free slots  re-opening on the 737-300 or any other queue  in the early years that then entice people to cancel and try for a better deal.  I looked at this queue when the plane was launched within a few hours and the first slots wer 10 years out.  I could name the plane from comet to current and if you put in an order and then the production queue consolidated, you actually didn't get much of of an advantage because rather than moving all the order ahead, new slots opened in between (I.e. If my initial order is. 10 years out because of 10 slots a month, when it goes to 30-50 a month you still end up 5 years out...even though new slots are open in year 1 and that IS the problem)...its really frustrating if this is the new standard (and yes I've played big and small airlines depending on my mood...but never seen this in past games to this level of nuts)

Speaking of nuts, just doing an order for 50 737-200s that are well past their expiration with a lot of open slots and they get spaced 1 a month with tons of room in between...in the past this would have been a 2-3 a month delivery at the end of the life cycle...but in this game 50 x 737-200adv means a nearly 4 year delivery 18 years into the production queue ....I do think something needs a review for these long games...I can't image what's to come with A320s/737next gens.   Well still be trying to replace 727s in 2020 in this GW ;) :laugh:
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 04:34:43 AM by spiff23 »

Offline spiff23

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Re: Huge Gaps in Deliverie in GW2
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2018, 04:44:46 AM »
Cancelled orders? Anything is possible. Okay so if thatís a no go, then letís talk about the in game robo-brokers.

As I understand it, those unused slots usually end up being broker purchases. Brokers who sometimes end up just parking the frame for months, years at a time before offering for sale. Why? Parked frames donít make money and it artificially tightens the market.

Instead those brokers should as a default turn the frames on UM immediately just as a player-broker would.

The weird thing in this one...last GW2 I was the only player that ordered the 747-400 in volume.  The AI broker ordered about 4 for every 1 I ordered so there was something like 800 frames built and almost all of them were stored from the get go (checking the fleet log)....Conversely I've never seen this with popular planes that everyone wants early on...just pointing out as it just stood out when you are the big operator of a fleet type no one else wants how many the game brokers end up taking delivery that never even make it to the UM.

 

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