AirwaySim
Online Airline Management Simulation
Login
Username
Password
 
or login using:
 
My Account
Username:
E-mail:
Edit account
» Achievements
» Logout
Game Credits
Credit balance: 0 Cr
Buy credits
» Credit history
» Credits FAQ

Author Topic: [ok] Game Start Fairness  (Read 3012 times)

Offline Zobelle

  • Members
  • Posts: 1770
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #40 on: November 28, 2017, 11:32:22 PM »
What about all the janky UM on day one that suddenly become good two weeks in?

Offline Talentz

  • Members
  • Posts: 1122
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #41 on: November 28, 2017, 11:53:57 PM »
What about all the janky UM on day one that suddenly become good two weeks in?


Well, Sami has already stated there is a limit to how much can be controlled on his end. So, at least removing the additional cash will blunt the strategy of those whose purpose is to take advantage of janky UM. Plus as a bonus, Sami seems to be moving in a direction where slot costs represent a far more money sink at the start of the game. So less money overall. 

While not perfect, I think its a strong step in the right direction. The next steps would be to implement the above, observe the effects in GW3 and adjust where needed.


Talentz
Co-founder and Managing member of: The Star Alliance Group™ - A beta era, multi-brand alliance.

Offline Zobelle

  • Members
  • Posts: 1770
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2017, 12:19:14 AM »
Slot cost too high as it is and with significantly less profit is a non starter.

Offline Sami

  • Administrator
  • Members
  • Posts: 16943
    • AirwaySim - Are you the next Richard Branson?
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #43 on: November 29, 2017, 12:20:06 AM »
In next update:

Game start used aircraft generation adjusted: Minimum age of airplanes to appear there is now 2.5yrs (previously 4.9yrs). (nb. other than this there are no differences in game start vs. later stages on what gets picked to the aircraft market from the storage pool - after the game starts the min.age is 0.5yrs)

Game start money growth adjusted: The money factor does not change for the first 30 game days, which after it starts to grow slowly (previously growth started from day 1 with a slow rate). (example: 0 days to the game at largest class airport starting cash is $3mil, 30 days in it is still $3mil, at 60 days it is $3.2mil, and at 120 days $3.8mil - but it is not so simple, there are other factors too like inflation).


These should cover the main points of the initial request, instead of making a set of new rules/limits for this.

(Oh and by the way ... The slot cost factor in current new GW#1 is actually LOWER than in GW#2.....)
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 12:24:52 AM by Sami »

Offline Zobelle

  • Members
  • Posts: 1770
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #44 on: November 29, 2017, 12:25:58 AM »
In next update:

Game start used aircraft generation adjusted: Minimum age of airplanes to appear there is now 2.5yrs (previously 4.9yrs). (nb. other than this there are no differences in game start vs. later stages on what gets picked to the aircraft market from the storage pool - after the game starts the min.age is 0.5yrs)

Game start money growth adjusted: The money factor does not change for the first 30 game days, which after it starts to grow slowly (previously growth started from day 1 with a slow rate). (example: 0 days to the game at largest class airport starting cash is $3mil, 30 days in it is still $3mil, at 60 days it is $3.2mil, and at 120 days $3.8mil - but it is not so simple, there are other factors too like inflation).



(Oh and by the way ... The slot cost factor in current new GW#1 is actually LOWER than in GW#2.....)
Compared to the ticket prices in GW2 though for the same era though it’s not even close. So even if slots cost similar the profits aren’t there to generate so they might as well be twice as expensive.

Offline Sami

  • Administrator
  • Members
  • Posts: 16943
    • AirwaySim - Are you the next Richard Branson?
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #45 on: November 29, 2017, 12:31:06 AM »
Compared to the ticket prices in GW2 though for the same era though it’s not even close. So even if slots cost similar the profits aren’t there to generate so they might as well be twice as expensive.

I was not talking about ticket prices or comparing actual dollar amounts. Slot costs are set with a relative factor (i.e "x1.5") that scales the costs from the inflation levels etc. (like all other costs, but that includes also the profits and ticket prices)

Slot cost factor in GW#2 is currently about 50% higher (= the same slot will cost that much more there compared to GW1). (what it is in real dollars of that day is irrelevant, since it cannot be compared because of different game years and possible different inflation factors .. but just as an example a set of LHR 8am slots in GW#2 is $2.5mil and in GW#1 $1.1mil; in the dollars of that year in that game - but those are not comparable like I mentioned)
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 12:37:17 AM by Sami »

Offline Zombie Slayer

  • Members
  • Posts: 4682
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #46 on: November 29, 2017, 12:31:18 AM »
In next update:

Game start used aircraft generation adjusted: Minimum age of airplanes to appear there is now 2.5yrs (previously 4.9yrs). (nb. other than this there are no differences in game start vs. later stages on what gets picked to the aircraft market from the storage pool - after the game starts the min.age is 0.5yrs)

Game start money growth adjusted: The money factor does not change for the first 30 game days, which after it starts to grow slowly (previously growth started from day 1 with a slow rate). (example: 0 days to the game at largest class airport starting cash is $3mil, 30 days in it is still $3mil, at 60 days it is $3.2mil, and at 120 days $3.8mil - but it is not so simple, there are other factors too like inflation).



(Oh and by the way ... The slot cost factor in current new GW#1 is actually LOWER than in GW#2.....)

Looks like a good adjustment.

Re: Slot costs. How about fares? GW1, 1965 ALG-BOM default Y price is $129, in GW2 in 1971 default price is $362.

Edit: Sorry, you posted 12 seconds before me.
Co-founder Elite Worldwide Alliance
PacAir President and CEO
Designated "Tier 1" Opponent

Offline Sami

  • Administrator
  • Members
  • Posts: 16943
    • AirwaySim - Are you the next Richard Branson?
Re: Game Start Fairness
« Reply #47 on: November 29, 2017, 12:34:50 AM »
Re: Slot costs. How about fares? GW1, 1965 ALG-BOM default Y price is $129, in GW2 in 1971 default price is $362.

The inflation curve starts at a different level and is different between #1 and #2 so the true dollar amounts, even in the same game year, won't probably match (and hence not useful to compare).

But all costs & incomes are factored through that that "value of money" index so it's not worth at looking at the actual dollar amounts between games since all costs in any particular game are scaled to that game's inflation index only. (= values between two games are not relevant)

(edit: out of interest; the current "value of money" or "inflation" index in GW#1 is current at about "x16" while in GW#2 it is at about "x43"; they will reach the same end point at the end of the game so the difference is really only noticeable at the first decades.)
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 12:40:07 AM by Sami »

Offline schro

  • Members
  • Posts: 4461
Re: [ok] Game Start Fairness
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2017, 01:17:24 AM »
Thanks for implementing this - I hope it plays out well. I think the only thing that I'd adjust is starting the money climb faster - one game month into a game most players have a whopping 3-4 planes as they struggle to pay for slots. The extra 200k is good for about a half slot set at a major airport. It usually takes about 6 months to get out of the slow growth grind, so I'd suggest that it starts there (unless this works fine for GW3).

The other variable for GW3 is that there will be a far different plane selection compared to the past two world starts, where there's been just a couple of desirable types versus in 3 where there will be far more...

Offline yearofthecactus

  • Members
  • Posts: 583
Re: [ok] Game Start Fairness
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2017, 01:23:40 AM »
It took a while to break through, but this is excellent news, and closes one of the biggest frustrations and disparities the game creates. Contrary to what you may think, the annoyances of this game that rile us, are small bugs, that create big side effects.

To re-reiterate David's point, the request here is to stop the advantage gained by starting late, that in this game world played havoc, and benefited many (including myself, even though it wasn't the purpose, as I bk'ed out after death spiraling).  But we don't want to penalize it either. So don't go too far the other way either and stop players wanting to join!

But yeh, thanks for doing it.

 

WARNING! This website is not compatible with the old version of Internet Explorer you are using.

If you are using the latest version please turn OFF the compatibility mode.