Unfair competition, breaking the rules and no actions from administration...

[Tim]

So, that my story:
I've joined DOTM4 world 10 years after it started. I based in AMS/EHAM, my favorite European location, because of a lot available slots. Then, like any other small starting airline, I'd started searching routes without competition. I'd found 3 longhaul destinations to small North American countries for 3 my DC10 and 2 European cities for 1 B732. And everything did very well until one of my bigger (much bigger than me) competitors had started attack to 4 of 5 my routes. I'd checked the manual and discovered that

"Any coordinated "attacks" by single airlines, alliances, or by any other group of airlines, to prevent some airline from operating on a route or to deliberately push some airline out of the simulation are not allowed. Competition is generally free in the sim but any clearly unfair competition measures such as flying routes with huge overcapacity and with very low prices and deliberately targeting many/all routes of a single airline are considered unfair competition, especially if the "target" is a new / small airline."

So, I wrote about this situation directly to sami... Yesterday midday... And still no answer, no action... My airline is in red zone now and going down... I don't understand what's going on...

[mavi]

Sami is very prompt and active, but I think he deserves more than 24 hours before complaining to the forums.

[Sami]

Indeed, I am abroad at the moment, and have not been able to check the situation yet, since I would have to ask the other party too.

But based on your description.. directly opening routes against a new competitor (on all his routes) is something that is not allowed.

[Tim]

Thank you, sami! I just just very disappointed about this situation and player's actions.

[BRM]

Ok, I will declare bankruptcy so you can have the whole AMS to yourself. Trust me, I have been attacked before.

[BRM]

Tim, here you go. 

[Airbus101]

Tim, did you ever bother to contact the other airline and tell them your new?

when I was new I contacted an airline and they actually helped me when they found out I was new...

[ARASKA]

VDM Airways has declared bankruptcy
VDM Airways has been put into bankruptcy today by the airline CEO. All operations of this airline are ceased, all staff will be fired, and all assets and aircraft are returned to their owners or to creditors.

VDM Airways operated from Amsterdam - Schiphol (EHAM / AMS) airport and had a fleet of 157 aircraft in operation at the time of the closure.

You happy now Tim?

[JumboShrimp]

I just want to plug my "New Player Protection System", that would prevent this...

https://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,38388.0.html

[Sami]

Oh well. Talking of a wee-bit "drama queen" effect again here and completely unnecessary overreaction. Before I have been even able to check what's going on. It really is not THAT serious.

[exchlbg]

Looking at "first registration" dates, who is the beginner ?
Do I have a RIGHT to open company at a highly competetive airport as AMS and a GUARANTEE my routes will be safe?
Do I have a GUARANTEE to start right with longhaul, fly 3 aircraft from at least 2 groups and stay in the green all the time ?
Should I start complaining to SAMI if something goes wrong before at least trying to clear things up with competitor?

[ARASKA]

Looking at "first registration" dates, who is the beginner ?
Do I have a RIGHT to open company at a highly competetive airport as AMS and a GUARANTEE my routes will be safe?
Do I have a GUARANTEE to start right with longhaul, fly 3 aircraft from at least 2 groups and stay in the green all the time ?
Should I start complaining to SAMI if something goes wrong before at least trying to clear things up with competitor?

+1

[swiftus27]

This went way too far too quick for no reason.

[CX717]

Didn't even know this rule exist,and frankly it is a stupid rule.
I used to attack fresh airlines that start in my base,to prevent him from making profit or at least slow him down a bit.
When you choose a major hub with a couple of well established airlines,you know the competition are going to be rough.

[Sanabas]

Do I have a RIGHT to open company at a highly competetive airport as AMS and a GUARANTEE my routes will be safe?

Nope.

Do I have a GUARANTEE to start right with longhaul, fly 3 aircraft from at least 2 groups and stay in the green all the time ?

Nope. However, when the existing airline's pax graph has been basically static for 12 months, and you've found 3 empty, ~150-250 pax routes to start flying to small caribbean airports, which all have a competitor's flight suddenly appear, I reckon feeling aggrieved is ok.

Should I start complaining to SAMI if something goes wrong before at least trying to clear things up with competitor?

PMing the competitor is a good first option. Waiting a few days for Sami to get back to you is good. A public forum thread after 24 hours, and an 'ok, I'll BK then' response are a bit over the top.

[Tim]

Didn't even know this rule exist,and frankly it is a stupid rule.
I used to attack fresh airlines that start in my base,to prevent him from making profit or at least slow him down a bit.
When you choose a major hub with a couple of well established airlines,you know the competition are going to be rough.

Yes, I used these methods before until someday sami wrote me that he'd got a message from fresh airline, and that I'm breaking the rules. So, now I'm giving some time to new players =)

Anyway, sami, we need kind of automatic system to detect these situations.

[Dasha]

If you don't want competition, go to Vanuatu, not Amsterdam.


Just my two cents..

[Kadachiman]

What is attack and what is prevention?

If a new airline starts at the base you are at, why wouldn't you try to limit his/her growth so that he/she doesn't become a major competitor....it's far cheaper and easier to get rid of them before they grow......and ounce of prevention is better than a ton of cure.

Let's not forget that the new airline 'MADE THEIR CHOICE' to start at an established base....so they need to take all consequences that come with making THEIR decision.


I currently have a very aggressive airline at the base I am at in MT...he grabs slots so quick when they are released that he grows fast and the others have to wait (with brand new planes parked up)...but instead of complaining I sent him a PM complimenting him on his good game-play...why...I chose to start at a larger base so knew I would have good competition.

Maybe we need two version of each game world.....a competitive version with no 'allowances' made and a sandbox version for people that want it easier.

[[ATA] - lilius]

 Best thread ever all thanks to the "push button to BK"-reaction and the "Happy now?"-comments 

[ARASKA]

it is a stupid rule.

Agreed