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Author Topic: Question on Seat Class / Demand  (Read 4046 times)

Lonesome_Phoenix

  • Former member
Question on Seat Class / Demand
« on: July 28, 2009, 01:44:00 PM »
Ok, so when you open the route planning window between 2 airports the chart will tell you how much the demand for each class is (Y, C and F), but my question is:

I some airline is already flying some route with an All-Economy-Class aircraft for eg., and I start flying the same route with and All-Business-Class aircraft, will the first class demand be directed to me??

I've be trying to figure out the demand flow in this game but its so tricky!

Kontio

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2009, 01:52:39 PM »
No. First class passengers will not travel in business class.

Offline Sami

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2009, 01:53:47 PM »
If there are Y & C seats available, a small portion of F class will take C class seats .. Can't remember what it was but let's say 10-25% of the F demand.

Lonesome_Phoenix

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2009, 02:23:33 PM »
OK, just to make sure I get it right, in the previous example, if I fly an aircraft with all-first-class config, then all the first class demand WILL be directed to me, right?

Offline Sami

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2009, 02:28:59 PM »
Basically yes, if nobody else is flying C or F classes.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2009, 02:33:43 PM »
Some airlines have done really well this way early off in the game.

samomuransky

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2009, 11:03:39 PM »
Well, about this... In past I had one aircraft which from scheduling reasons operated also one route with no C demand (however, it had C seats). So I set price to same as Y and... nobody use it! Also when I later flew C for 1 buck and Y for 60. People bought more expensive Y.. this should be changed to more realistic :)

bigdogshark62

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2009, 12:54:15 PM »
I agree with Samo here.  If the C or F seats are priced the same as Y, why wouldn't the Y buyers NOT buy them (I sure would; matter of fact I HAVE on American and US Airways when they offered it).   This would be a realistic change. 

Lonesome_Phoenix

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2009, 01:30:25 PM »
Well here's something for you: I started playing the AirwaySim Demo today, I established my base and started flying some routes, and although I'm the only one flying some of those routes and there's a lot of demand for them, still my AvgLF is stuck around 45% on all of them!

d2031k

  • Former member
Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2009, 01:32:03 PM »
It takes time for pax to find your route.  Its on the reminder thread from Sami :

http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,11625.0.html

Offline Sami

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2009, 02:17:17 PM »
Well here's something for you: I started playing the AirwaySim Demo today, I established my base and started flying some routes, and although I'm the only one flying some of those routes and there's a lot of demand for them, still my AvgLF is stuck around 45% on all of them!

Like planned as even there may be demand, the people still don't know about your service and that it exists on that route. Give it 6 months or so. Check the link in previous post.

However gotta add that the calculations do need work still as I'm not entirely happy with them (never will??) .. but that's most likely to next version as I'm trying to avoid any large changes in the middle of the games. I have to check first how things go and what needs to be changed and then make the plans.

bigdogshark62

  • Former member
Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2009, 07:37:29 PM »
It makes sense to me that people wouldn't know the route so well when it starts, however many of us start advertising the route prior to flying it.  So in reality, more people will know that a new airline is running routes than if there were no advertising. 

My suggestion would be this:

For those routes where there is competition on a route, and the airline doesn't advertise before starting the route (or starts running ads the same day the route starts), keep the formulas as they are.  It will take time for an airline to build a reputation on that route.  Start the LF's at 45% or so.  For those routes with competition where the airline starts advertising at least a week prior to the route starting, start the LF's at 50-55%. 

For those routes with no competition where there is no advertising in place prior to the route starting, start the LF's at 60-65%.  For those no competition routes where advertising starts at least a week in advance, start the LF's at 65-70%.  After all, passengers want to fly on that route.  Once an airline starts flying there, people are going to rush to use that service, at least at first.  As an alternative, on no competition routes with advertising, start the LF's out at 85-90% (because people are excited about the new service), and then the LF's drop to 65-70% after 2 weeks to a month.  The LF's will rise again as advertising raises the route image and company image. 

Additionally, if a company neglects the route (either by not upgrading the aircraft, not advertising the route for more than a year, or a new airline comes in), their route image would slowly drop.  A company would have to start re-advertising a route (especially when competition starts in a market) in order to retain their route image, or raise it back up to 100. 

Anyway, that's my .02 (adjusted for inflation/deflation/aeration/rotation)... 

Offline JonesyUK

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2009, 07:49:38 PM »


Additionally, if a company neglects the route (either by not upgrading the aircraft, not advertising the route for more than a year, or a new airline comes in), their route image would slowly drop.  A company would have to start re-advertising a route (especially when competition starts in a market) in order to retain their route image, or raise it back up to 100.  


Nice in theory, but when you have over a thousand different routes, it would be a nightmare to keep adding marketing campaigns to existing routes

bigdogshark62

  • Former member
Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2009, 09:57:08 PM »
Nice in theory, but when you have over a thousand different routes, it would be a nightmare to keep adding marketing campaigns to existing routes

Thousand FLIGHT, I can understand that...  Thousand ROUTES, I highly doubt it... 

You wouldn't have to be adding campaigns to every single route all the time.  Only those routes where the route image has started dropping due to competition or neglect (like flying an old aircraft on the route for years).  It wouldn't take THAT much time.  As it is right now, once a route reaches 100%, that airline can just "set it and forget it."  And in real life, that's not how it works.  Airlines are constantly having to remind their passengers that they're flying the route, and that they're always improving their service.  Otherwise, the flying public becomes "complacent" and their demand for the route starts to tail off.

I know.  I've been a Delta Platinum for 5 years.  I'm in a different airport every week.  I see how advertising affect Buffalo or Montgomery, AL or Boston, or how it affects Christchurch or Wellington or Whangarei.  Finnair even advertises in Oulu about their flights to Helsinki.  How long has Finnair flown the Oulu-Helsinki route? 

I still think it would be a good idea for route image to taper off, and airlines have to keep an eye on it and renew advertising on those routes occasionally.

Offline Flightman

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #14 on: August 04, 2009, 10:18:25 PM »
I have tried to find good balance with y, c, and F class seats. Now beginning of the game it seems good idea to "take all" in f class on your own, but good thinker knows, that when other airliners getting stronger, they will competive with u in same route. And reconfig seats arent cheap. Hopefully my competitors focus on just C or F class... Then I get all Y:s :)

Balance and tactics - is all your need.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2009, 10:23:49 PM by Flightman »
Vallin Airlines brings your destination closer

Lonesome_Phoenix

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2009, 11:59:39 AM »
It makes sense to me that people wouldn't know the route so well when it starts, however many of us start advertising the route prior to flying it.  So in reality, more people will know that a new airline is running routes than if there were no advertising.

You must mean the airline! not the route! if I'm planning to travel from City A to City B, I will call my booking agent and he will offer me some options on different airlines and times to choose from, then I will make my choice, I may have suspicions about flying with a new airline because I never heard of them, or maybe I prefer a specific airline, but, theoretically speaking, if a new airline advertises itself and provides a good service, then people will start talking and before you know it every body will start flying with that airline or at least give it an equal opportunity to their preferred airline if their preferred airline doesn't have a flight at the time they need to travel or is fully booked! I wouldn't delay my trip to the next day if my favorite airline's flight is fully booked and if I've heard about this new airline! I'd give it a try!

Don't you think?

bigdogshark62

  • Former member
Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2009, 05:09:27 AM »
Yeah...  I meant "airline."   8)

Offline JonesyUK

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Re: Question on Seat Class / Demand
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2009, 01:46:50 PM »
Thousand FLIGHT, I can understand that...  Thousand ROUTES, I highly doubt it...  


In Jet Age 1 I have :
Number of Routes  1098  
Weekly flights  11492

Imagine looking after and constantly marketing all of those routes(!)

To me, your general marketing looks after the upkeep of route image. The odd billboard here, a newspaper advert there. There's no need for a full blown campaign for every route once it's established.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2009, 01:49:26 PM by JonesyUK »

 

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