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Author Topic: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud  (Read 1645 times)

Offline CarlBagot

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2016, 10:07:45 PM »
....  Do not attribute every action  to malice,  it creates unnecessary drama.  Most (99% and of veterans I'd say closer to 100%) people are here to win fair and square,  it's not fun otherwise.

Offline MASATA

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #21 on: March 13, 2016, 02:03:49 AM »
MASATA Arabiyah is funded by major political donations and favouritism from the national bureau of air transportation of the Royal family of Kuwait.


^^^ Seriously if you think that was the case, then you have a pretty weak understanding of how AWS works soho ;)
CEO MASATA Global
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Darlinghurst, NSW 2010
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Offline Sami

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #22 on: March 13, 2016, 03:15:04 AM »
And another important thing to my mind - most of info here closed and when Sami demanding proofs from closed bases it sounds very strange

ummm.. Sorry. What?

Absolutely no idea what you are trying to say.



Offline hmellouli

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #23 on: March 13, 2016, 03:17:27 AM »
Much fuss about almost nothing. And some rather wild associations about fake accounts and other things to which I really don't agree to.


Pretty Much!

I am playing another on-line game for several years and have desided to check this one and immediately faced misconduct why?

Alliances purpose in real life - generate profit via code share (same as another game) but here - generate profit via undercover deals with planes//In that game you can buy plane only on open auction and ALL info is open, but here all info is closed, covered wich leads to Alliances became a some kind of trading corporations and manipulate with planes and profits.

Let us make ONLY OPEN AUCTION SALE/LEASE !!!

Im I wrong?

And another important thing to my mind - most of info here closed and when Sami demanding proofs from closed bases it sounds very strange


I know the other game you're talking about. It's one of the worst designed websites i have ever used. incredibly non-user friendly. that simulation is also different than this one in a lot of ways, some better, and some worse. nonetheless, it's a different system. you keep attributing alliances to misconduct, but in fact the only one with misconduct here is you. alliances are a cooperative setting that makes these stress and competitiveness of this game much easier to enjoy. without alliances this game would suck and it would be completely different.

no manipulation happening here, only in your head. I'm sure sami can attest to how all of us are pretty much tattletales when we think there is misconduct. the game is ruined when someone doesn't play by the rules, so even if it might be easier to break thee rules, our time and money investment in this game, as well as the morals of most of us, insure that we keep this game played by the rules!

if you don't like it, you're more than free to leave and troll someone else. no one needs your drama!

Soho

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #24 on: March 13, 2016, 06:54:40 AM »
Some of you are afraid of open information otherwise all manipulations will be obvious.
No drama - comedy of 30-x with mafia trading planes (not playing planes) covered by Sami (who is Sami?)
Cats mafia cover trade planes, block production slots, block airport slots via vpn, make garbage companies for old fleet and buncrupt them (like Dragon ATA) because no rules to overcome this misconduct or no dogs (exept one) to stop this or may be this dog for a peace of meat send them friendly warnings?
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 09:08:08 AM by Soho »

Offline MASATA

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #25 on: March 13, 2016, 01:54:05 PM »
Some of you are afraid of open information otherwise all manipulations will be obvious.
No drama - comedy of 30-x with mafia trading planes (not playing planes) covered by Sami (who is Sami?)
Cats mafia cover trade planes, block production slots, block airport slots via vpn, make garbage companies for old fleet and buncrupt them (like Dragon ATA) because no rules to overcome this misconduct or no dogs (exept one) to stop this or may be this dog for a peace of meat send them friendly warnings?

Can you elaborate?
пожалуйста, дополните

Thank you.
Спасибо
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 01:56:16 PM by [ATA] MASATA »
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Offline fearmywrath

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #26 on: March 14, 2016, 04:15:03 AM »
Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud

I say have nothing against alliances.
But some formally following rules of the game, but in fact violate the spirit of the game.

Here are some examples.

Two members of An alliance offered me to buy a 600 slots in Beijing. which they did not have. It turned out that they sell slots of a third company, once deal failed, after bankruptcy The company immediately has become a member of this alliance (by invitation only) in a new place.

Pumping planes is normal here. Rules Say:Normal one-time sales of aircraft is naturally allowed but transferring aircraft with the only intention of at the same time generating profits/money to one airline is considered unacceptable. They use A-B-C pumping and formally that's ok. I was wandering why a company of this alliance with debit account had profit 20 mln per qtr of non-operational profit with no own planes!

Fake companies. In spite of the assurances providers I easily registered a company with a new ip and name of my own using TOR (later terminated). There is every reason to believe that the so-called new members of An Alliance (by the invitation only) – just fake companies. Other than can be explained by the simultaneous failure of several companies in a region after “mother” company fails where they had one purpose - to create the appearance of presence.

Soho

Lol, a lot things happened after your failed greedy negotiation?

Soho, looks like you are doing a lot of things behind the curtain.

Ok. Finally I have sometime after a busy week. Alright, I will reply to your points (as much as I can, as I dont have time to read all your false accusation).

Timeline:

Business Select opened an AL in Beijing on 1st day of the Game.
I, Dragon Airline opened an AL in Shanghai on 1st day of the Game.
Business Select joined A-Star ( I dont know when, assume the 1st day)
Dragon Airline join A-Star (cant remember, but maybe 3rd day?). When I joined Alliance, I was advised China already has a member so we will split in future.
in 1966, Flower dropped in SHA, however I cannot drop in PEK as a return because of the Alliance rule. However, Business Select was on the verge of BK. At that time, I was busy defending my share in SHA. I had to make a hard decision whether I should go to PEK to compete against Flower. If I dont, Flower will eat all those slots Business select will vacate and he will eat me in SHA alive with almost uncompeted PEK as his bank. Therefore, with the intention of cooperating, I approached Soho. I suggested he will join our Alliance, as we cannot have two member in one city, if he joins our Alliance, not only he would get PEK slots, I will have to vacate CAN as well because he is at CAN. Then he replied he have 200 planes off base already. Then I told me, that's OK, then I will go to PEK instead. Soho immeditely replied with this :

"
I guess it's your business, but I needed your confirmation.
Change 600 PEK to 1200 CAN honestly not quite fair but undoubtedly will meet the interests of the alliance
I agree to close base in CAN if
- Exclusive rights from/to PEK from now and in future by my request (if any);
- Very special to my c/p in NKG;
- Base in PVG reseved;"

I was like WTF? 600 PEK and 1200 CAN and he thinks it's not fair? PEK's slots are 90% taken and 99% if you counting the normal hours. CAN slots are available everywhere. You dont need to give me those slots, I just grab them as I wish.
"Exclusive rights from/to PEK?", WTF? Alliance is for helping each other, not for your greedy appetite.
"Very special? "PVG reserved"? Hang on, I started this conversation for cooperation, not for submission.

As for the accusation of trading planes, I dont know what's wrong with that. Alliance trades planes, at min/max alliance price. Business select has helped me alot, he sold me a lot F27s even he struggles with cash flow. I thank him for that, of course I would help him to start over again. Sorry, I'm not as greedy as some. I wont emall Business select and saying "I will sell you plane but I need exclusive rights for your routes". Sorry, I'm no such person.

Sorry for the messy writing, I have to get running in 2 minutes - that's exactly the same reason why I quitted and BKed. I had an unexpected situation at work. Looks like my quitting raises another level of conspiracy theory.



Online ZombieSlayer

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #27 on: March 14, 2016, 10:37:38 AM »
Ok, you just admitted to a major infraction. I think at least 2/3 of those PEK slots need to be released to the public.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2016, 12:12:12 PM by ZombieSlayer »
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Offline Dasha

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #28 on: March 14, 2016, 03:03:23 PM »
I think you all need to calm your t*** down and remind yourself it's a game.


Simple Definition of game
: a physical or mental activity or contest that has rules and that people do for pleasure

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/game

Just my 2 ¢.

But I'm a woman, I might not understand half of what's going on here. Lots of ego's and stuff... :)
The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes, decide everything

Offline Mr Yoda

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #29 on: March 14, 2016, 03:30:37 PM »
At the end of the day you only get a digital achievement and credits if you're lucky...

Offline [SC] - King Kong

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2016, 04:01:00 PM »
I think you all need to calm your t*** down and remind yourself it's a game.


Simple Definition of game
: a physical or mental activity or contest that has rules and that people do for pleasure

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/game

Just my 2 ¢.

But I'm a woman, I might not understand half of what's going on here. Lots of ego's and stuff... :)

Half a woman. Don't exaggerate

Offline LotusAirways

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #31 on: March 15, 2016, 03:01:27 AM »
And to summarize:

1) "...An airline called Dragon China (sic) closes down...", an event duly noted on my alliance record keeping forum:

Noteworthy Bankruptcies -- March 11, 2016, 06:02:38 PM
China Dragon Airlines has been put into bankruptcy today by the airline CEO. All operations of this airline are ceased, all staff will be fired, and all assets and aircraft are returned to their owners or to creditors. China Dragon Airlines had a fleet of 638 aircraft in operation at the time of the closure.
Base airports of this airline were: Shanghai Hongqiao (ZSSS / SHA) / Kunming Wujiaba (ZPPP / KMG) / Nanjing Lukou (ZSNJ / NKG) / Shenzhen Bao'an (ZGSZ / SZX)

2) "... and just in one click 2 more small shadow companies in China dissapear (sic) in spite of new opportunities. These copanies (sic) started from the early game were keeping slots in PEK..."

So Sami rightly replies: "...What airlines, where, when, etc?". So perhaps for the future we can use Jumbo's suggestion "Players with complaints can do all the work, and their complaint can be based on facts, rather than suspicions." by just improving a few small things:

- On Airline News, add the player name on bankruptcies. This should be an easy fix.
- Extend the Arline News Feed, ideally the history should be available since day one but perhaps just the last 6 months news is enough.

Miaow

Offline hmellouli

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #32 on: March 15, 2016, 03:23:44 AM »
...
So Sami rightly replies: "...What airlines, where, when, etc?". So perhaps for the future we can use Jumbo's suggestion "Players with complaints can do all the work, and their complaint can be based on facts, rather than suspicions." by just improving a few small things:

- On Airline News, add the player name on bankruptcies. This should be an easy fix.
- Extend the Arline News Feed, ideally the history should be available since day one but perhaps just the last 6 months news is enough.

Miaow

also, add alliance. that would centrally help show a coordinated alliance BK.

Offline bdnascar3

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #33 on: March 15, 2016, 12:57:36 PM »
Ok I feel that I have to speak up. There was not coordination on the BK's When my airline (Business Select) BK'd I did not coordinate with anyone. Yes the alliance knew I was going to bk,it was obvious and it is a matter of courtesy to let your alliance know your in trouble.But they did not when. Yes, my alliance tried to work a deal to keep a good airline in China. When I bk'd I had aprox 600 slots that would go to the open market. So the alliance had 3 choices, move existing alliance airline (china dragon) into PEK, get another airline into PEK to compete, or do nothing. They tried and failed to get another airline into PEK. Later on due to real life issues China Dragon also had to BK. In both cases it was just a normal  mechanism of the game. In fact, argument could be made that it hurt our alliance, not helped it by having two large airlines BK. But just because the 600 slots were on the open market and the alliance knew of a pending BK, does not mean that the alliance will pick up said slots. They were still open to anyone.

Alliance's are about information,that's it. There is no financial advantage to being in an alliance in this game.The only advantage is the sharing of information. Hints and tactical ways to play, information on better/worse types of aircraft to fly, information on UM and new aircraft release when your away from AWS.

Offline Dasha

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #34 on: March 15, 2016, 06:26:52 PM »
*grabs popcorn*
The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes, decide everything

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #35 on: March 15, 2016, 06:54:36 PM »
- On Airline News, add the player name on bankruptcies. This should be an easy fix.
- Extend the Arline News Feed, ideally the history should be available since day one but perhaps just the last 6 months news is enough.

Good suggestions.

Offline Dasha

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #36 on: March 15, 2016, 08:42:32 PM »
If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

To quote the ever wise and almighty Louis van Gaal....


You make from a fly an elephant.
The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes, decide everything

Offline aeropostale

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Re: Sub-culture of An alliance and fraud
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2016, 11:31:01 PM »
*grabs popcorn*

Took the words out of my mouth  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

 

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