Well, like I said, maybe I was just bitching cause a Titan had just opened up on a good route for me, and since then Titan 2 has opened up. Maybe I have an actual point that doesn't need agreement or disagreement.
To clarify: I define experienced player by the achievements listed in their profile, not just time on board. A person can be experienced but not necessarily a veteran player, veterans are all experienced. That's what I didn't define properly. From the little experience I have I'd say the veterans play nice in the BW, some of the experienced don't.
I realise the longer GW are much different, exponentially more difficult. One look at the forum with tell you this, looking at a lot of the forums will tell you this again and again and again, so anybody getting into the real games thinking it's just a longer BW didn't do their research and maybe they deserve to fail. What is very clear from the forums is the biggest problem in this game is airlines growing far too big. The Titans. Many game changes have slowed them, but eventually people adapt. So the next thing to do is to just ASK them to at least take it a bit easier in the BW where new people get introduced to the game. All players will make the choice in this stage of their playing "career" to either stay and try some more or just give up, and IMO early on isn't the place to put them off. I got the feeling that many would just give up. Sami, you got the numbers on that? Anyway, I started playing airline games with AeroBiz for Super Nintendo (showing my age), and I've been dreaming for a simulation/game as appropriately complex, as appropriately challenging, with real people to play against as this one is. This is the best one out there. But a big impression I got in my little time here is that there are some players who just can't seem to relate to what its like being a newbie, and don't play nice. I'm thinking, "do I really want to bother, even though I've been wanting a game like this since leg warmers and shoulder pads were in. And if I feel like that given how much I wanted this then perhaps many others do, maybe too many do and to the detriment of the games sustainability." Maybe I'm just a sissy who needs to grow a pair! And hey, I realise that not everybody is gonna play nice, that's the nature of getting a group of people together to do something. Someone always seems to have to be the biggest, baddest mofo out there...but in a BW.
I just wanted have my say of what I've experienced, but I should've taken a deeper breath before writing...so as not to offend anyone. Sorry about that.
As I read back my first paragraphs from original post I see that they infer that I have a problem with many (perhaps even all) experienced players in BW. So I'll clarify that too. I do not. I was referring to the ones who go for world domination which as I've said, I think is at the expense of new users learning the basics, or advanced basics, and their desire to stick around and that is a valid observation since I am a new user... but I'm certainly not against all of the experienced players, nor even most of them in BW's. I started out a little miffed, then cooled down halfway through...forgot what I'd written above but did mellow a bit, even acknowledging that I may just be bitching, "Rant over". Anyway, I thought I had got my point out as I expressed my appreciation for the things I've learned from experienced/veteran players yet felt the game play of Titans is a detriment to new learners and perhaps those guys could either take it easy in BW or play somewhere else so us newbies could get a better handle on things. That's basically it. But looking at responses I see I didn't get it out right.
However, the beliefs of any players who have experience as to whether I'm right or wrong is irrelevant. You are not beginners any more. The game is different than when you were beginners. Things are different in the game now because players have gone through the stages up to now, made comments, pushed points and changes have been made.
Without those voices this game likely would have gone the way I'll go when I enter my first, second, third long GW.
But right now I am speaking with the voice of a new player, at this stage in development of the game, who says that I think a few, only a few, experienced players are making things tougher than they ought to be, and if ya gotta be James Cameron, you know, "King of the World", well, can you do it in another GW? I'll see you in the "Clash of the Titans" world some day, cause I also want to see just how much money I can make, how huge a fleet I can have etc. Yet I also want to see how I'll do starting out with props and low demand, making the transition to jets, dealing with D checks, fleet renewal, all that stuff. And I still have more somewhat advanced learning to do.
Maybe we need a Beginner World and Intermediate World. Maybe this has been done and didn't work. Maybe what is needed is long GW's with a lower player cap per game instead of 300-500. Therefore more GW's, starting so that there are none running in the same decade. Gives more options for people when to start and less likely to have horribly difficult numbers to compete against. GW's more oriented along the real world where, for example, a UK based airline cannot open in EDDF, LFPG or EHAM because their respective governments won't allow it in real life. I know opening EU bases doesn't come into effect until later in GW's. Perhaps an introduction of a "subsidiary" feature can be put in place (different from an alliance) where a UK airline wanting to break into the German market finds a suitable player in the market, PM's them and agree on a percentage of the profit/loss sharing on those new routes. They still run separate airlines. Experienced people could work with beginner's, beginners with beginners, experienced with experienced, whatever suits. That seems more real to me. And as far as upping the reality, what about losing a plane to accidents? Does that happen? Does anybody randomly loose a plane in bad weather, lowering CI, etc. In 70 years almost every airline loses a plane. What about wars, volcanoes, labour disputes? Maybe it takes someone honest to be paid to sit there and monitor all the games and manually throw in a dramatic event to bring people getting unrealistically out there back down to Earth.
I know these sorts of things have been talked about in other forum threads and as I see it it basically comes down to the time and effort it takes to programme all that stuff and the limited time developer(s) have. Which then brings me to what is really my main point of this whole thread...best not to put new people off the game right from the start. The more users there are the more money rolls in and the better chance we have of getting this incredible piece of work even better, more realistic, which is something I feel from reading many many forum threads that most people are looking for... as realistic a simulation as we can get. So yeah, what this is really, really all about was relating to yous how I, as a newbie, feel about what it's been like getting into this game/community/world, at this particular stage of development. Have you created a welcoming place or an exclusive club? Just so yous know, I'm not just some guy who showed up on the scene with lots to say without any clue. I read through a mountain of forum stuff, figured out what people are generally wanting, and came to the conclusion that it's as realistic a simulation as we can get. And to do that I reckon we just need a way to make sure developers have the incentive to put even more time into coding such realism, which I figure just needs more money so that more people can spend more time on it and not have their partners give them a hard time about spending so much time "playing airplanes". A healthy paycheck will ease the grief given, but still won't get anybody out of doing the dishes!!!
I just have one little bitch here...Aoitsuki, What's the point of offering a BW if some people have taken it upon themselves to show newbies that the real GW's are not as easy as BW and play hard? You've just taken away the BW and made it into a short normal world, you've moved the goal posts. The reality here is that anybody who gets into this game ought to have to choice to enter a long GW whether they are ready or not. It's kinda like if you were a professional soccer player and you saw some children kicking a ball around but you decided, "well if you are going to get into the professional leagues someday it's gonna be nothing like the children's league, so I'm gonna get in there and show you little people how to do it." Geez man, let people play the little league games and work their way up. Do you big boys always have to be on the field showing the little kids what it's gonna be like, hurting a few with aggressive play, breaking a few legs, leaving the children crying because "it's gonna be like that in the big league?" Well guess what, if we are in the BW we're not in the big league yet, and if we get in the big league before we are ready that's our problem. It's much better to let people have a try at something an give up when it gets too much for them later on rather than give them a bad experience on the little league field. And to tell me that when I enter a real game "to get a mentor asap, I will need it", is pure arrogance. Maybe I do, will you be my mentor? Do all mentor's tell their charges how to play the same way? Is there only one way to play this game? And if so are we all meant to be clones? Are all mentor's right? I may not need a mentor, maybe I do. Let me decide. I may do well on my own, or maybe I'll fail. But let me figure it out. What I do know is that I spent a lot of time looking at other players, their achievements, what they were doing in games, fleet choice, route times blah blah blah. I read a lot of forums, the manual, Curse's "manual". There is a wealth of information there, combined with my own triumphs and mistakes, my own personal history in the business. I feel like I've already been mentored by plenty of people cuz I'm not a dummy. I'e done plenty of research. I realise there are going to see planes I've never used before, situations I've never dealt with before and I'll choose how I deal with those. In real life, real airline bosses fail, and so it should be in this simulation. At least here, if we have a few dollars/euros, we can try and try again until we succeed or get bored.
So, those of you who are "playing nice" know who you are and can rest easy at night. Those who are not being as welcome in the BW's as I, IMHO think, well, I suppose you can sleep well too, but hey, you're gonna do what you're gonna do. If this game has to close because its no longer sustainable, then we've all lost something really good. If it's too exclusive that few want to join then that's a shame as well. If I'd developed this game I'd want loads and loads of people to be involved in this awesome cool thing, and have fun even though being challenged. Perhaps I'm being mellodramatic and don't know what I'm talking about, perhaps I'm right on the money, perhaps I'm half right or somewhere in between, it doesn't really matter. Just a new guys' opinion. That's okay, init?
Again, sorry for any offense caused. Maybe I shoulda got the peace pipe out before writing original message instead of halfway through.
May you all have wind beneath your wings...oh god, did I just quote Barbara Streisand?