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Author Topic: fleet type & commonality  (Read 1346 times)

SuriProf4

  • Former member
fleet type & commonality
« on: March 30, 2013, 01:33:53 AM »
i have been searching the forums for ~hour and cannot find a definite response.

when the fleet type is calculated, does that mean any airbus/boeing/etc is one fleet type? or the a32x/b73x/etc one fleet type, the a33x/b76x/etc one fleet type, and so?

i can see the airbus/boeing/etc are classified under one category in the commonality page. but i am having difficult to see what is the fleet type count is.

Offline LemonButt

  • Members
  • Posts: 1895
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2013, 03:41:01 AM »
AWS groups aircraft into fleet types that you can see on the aircraft pages titled "Fleet Group".  Boeing is not a fleet type, but a manufacturer.  Boeing makes many different models and some models even have multiple fleets within them, such as the 737 classic and 737 NG.  You can use the dropdown filters on the used/new aircraft pages to see the fleet groups.  Each one of these groups counts as one fleet type.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2013, 10:55:42 AM »
Just go to "new" or "used aircraft" page.Just open the filters for aircraft type: all models that have commonality are grouped/mentioned together,like "Airbus A319/320/321" .All other aircraft models are counted as a new fleet and will hit per commonality costs, which will also
be higher not only for new, but also for already used fleets by opening fourth,seventh,eleventh and so on.There is no advantage in using only one manufacturer, additional costs for new fleet will be as high as in using different manufacturers.

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2013, 12:25:21 PM »
so is using a32x, a33x/a34x, and atr will be the recommend 3 fleet groups i have been reading about?

no going into 4+ because of costs, from what i read.

Offline alexgv1

  • Members
  • Posts: 2184
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2013, 12:50:30 PM »
Yeah those would be 3 fleet groups. And not going to 4 is a wise idea. Especially as your fleets will increase if you decide to replace one with another type.
CEO of South Where Airlines (SWA|WH)

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2013, 12:57:53 PM »
thanks....was thinking if i should replace atr fleet with e170 fleet. but the atr are profit on their routes. they just donot have the range to get the routes i see the e170 serving.

have to think of best aircraft for those routes as i donot want to have the 'oversupply' message

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2013, 01:56:04 PM »
"Oversupply" ? If you are going to meet that limit, your scheduling/aircraft use is -ähem- doubtful.
Donīt go long, small routes ,even if aircraft has range, besides flights you do overnight for a better timing or to meet curfew. As a rule of thumb I wouldnīt go often more nm*10 than seates offered,two near 30-ish routes do much better than one far 60-ish.
Itīs ok to oversupply routes a bit if you fly them alone, but thereīs no use of getting near that 200% mark, prognosed demand just wonīt double because you offer seats. For special cases you also have the seat-limiter to be on the safe side.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2013, 01:32:09 PM by exchlbg »

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2013, 02:18:33 PM »
routes were at 70-90 pax/day demand. i had 131 seats scheduled on the routes. received message that said 'oversupply'. the sat flights were ~60 pax so i donot know if that is what was the reason.

to keep within current fleet i am just going to go after a318. i shouldnot have problems filling routes. the competition out of my airport is on the large airports and a few local routes.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2013, 04:57:30 AM »
You guessed right, the 60-seats demand on sa triggered the oversupply warning.To keep out the danger zone you always have to calculate with the lowest demand figure of any direction.And why did you put 131 seats on that route anyway?
« Last Edit: March 31, 2013, 04:59:44 AM by exchlbg »

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2013, 12:46:07 AM »
aircraft needed someplace to go. otherwise it would be sitting. needed to find some place to send it

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2013, 01:31:06 PM »
Thatīs a good reason.Use seat limiter then.

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2013, 10:02:53 PM »
i look at a few airlines and notice 3+ fleet types and curious if/how it affect their expenses. it appears not because their value is 100m+ in most cases.

so is the 3+ fleet type a real not to do? or am i missing something?

i am running at 3 fleet type, and find it hard at times to do certain routes do to the aircraft types i am running.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2013, 11:11:44 PM »
Itīs not the question of success or BK if you run 3+ aircraft models. That depends also on other variables like how many aircraft per fleet.
If costs are overall low, as in BW or early years elswhere, it doesnīt matter as much as in late MT. It  just means your airline is run more profitably and professionally and so is fit for future with a lean fleet. You will fly more aircraft models during "transition times", replacing older models by newer ones, anyway .
About routes: you possibly canīt and shouldnīt serve any available demand, only as much as possible with least possible aircraft models.Plan routes for your aircrafts, not aircrafts for routes.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2013, 11:56:18 PM by exchlbg »

SuriProf4

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2013, 11:23:02 PM »
so running 4 fleet type throughout game world willnot bk me if i run it right

stansu

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2013, 12:58:47 AM »
It really depends on other factors. Running more than 3 fleets itself won't BK you. It just increases your cost. I have seen some successful airlines using many fleet groups for various reason. Other than fleet transition, I think some people like to have as many a/c as possible to expand faster or even to occupy all slots for monopoly.

But when you have fierce competition, low load factor, high fuel price, expensive major maintenance, or combinations of above, this increased cost can mean you start losing money.


Offline bleedfax18

  • Members
  • Posts: 183
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2013, 03:57:18 PM »
Hi all,

as I didn't want to open a new thread, I thought my question would fit in here as well.

I currently have 4 fleet types. When I went from 3 to 4, I had the expected rise in commonality costs for all the fleet types. Now I realized that the costs have gone down again (for my A32x-fleet, it went down from 9 mill to 4 mill, about the amount it was before fleet type 4 entered). The only possible answer for me would be that my 4th fleet now also has 7 frames in it. Could that be the answer?

Thx
CEO of INterFly

L1011fan

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2013, 01:08:46 AM »
Generally. I have found if that as long as I have more than one or two (hopefully 3 or 4) of a different of fleet type, other than my main one, it doesn't affect much. Sometimes you just have to expand and in the real world, it's working for several airlines. It does raise costs to a point, so you have to cover yourself. I am running mainly Airbus but found it necessary to add a few 767's in order to take advantage of expansion. It really hasn't affected my bottom line to tell you the truth. At the time I needed to jump on some European routes while available and appropriate Airbus aircraft weren't available. So I added 4 767-200er's, so commonality hasn't really been compromised. If so, it's minimal. Just my take on it. ;)

brique

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2013, 05:08:18 AM »
If you are aware that commonality gets a bit expensive the more fleet types you operate, but are happy to bear that cost as the types you operate fulfil your particular needs and turn a decent profit, then its not any more problematic than say, the extra expense at HQ when you open a new base. It does mean you may not be as profitable as you could potentially be, running fewer fleet types, but thats not always possible either. So, its something you add to the calculation before you order that extra type.

Its hard to cover every kind of route/demand with few fleet types, inevitably, you'll not be using the optimal aircraft on each and every one : thats a cost too. So, you can end up going for the lesser of two evils : more fleet types with commonality expense but better route performance versus fewer types but less efficient route performance.

L1011fan is right, the more of a type you operate, the less onerous that commonality charge gets : and also that it can be better to fly anything to keep your competitive edge in a tight HQ than do nothing and watch your competition take the slots and routes. Its 'generally wrong' but not 'always wrong' : circumstance does change the parameters of 'wrongness'  and the extra cost can be overcome, but its always best to work from knowing that the issue exists and will require that extra bit of attention as the buffer -zone between profit and loss is that much thinner...

L1011fan

  • Former member
Re: fleet type & commonality
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2013, 02:27:28 AM »
Thank you brique! I knew I had a point. Thank you for validating it. LOL! :)
« Last Edit: April 21, 2013, 02:30:05 AM by L1011fan »

 

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