A bit disappointing...

[alexgv1]

...to see old and experienced players hogging the Top 20 airports already (perhaps because they cannot hack it in the harder worlds?). What about giving new players a chance to enjoy these big airports and letting the big boys fight it out in the harder game worlds? I don't think the purpose of this game world is this for the older players. Perhaps something more fitting for an experienced player would be an experiment airline (like the many of Swiftus). That is why I went to Iceland, to have a bit of fun running a small experiment airline there.

Of course I cannot dictate to people how to play the game, but I would ask the older players to search their conscience and give the younger players a chance. I'm sure they would prefer this than embarrassing themselves, there is no achievement to dominating a sandbox.

[Sami]

Yes, this is one thing that I have to keep an eye on. If these worlds become too much the playground of the "big and experienced", I have to re-impose some sort of restrictions to the next one.

As after all it is still supposed to be a beginner scenario, but with a "testing" ability for others too.

[SuriProf4]

i would like to learn how to play this sim. but from reading the forums this past week and seeing the op note, i feel it is going to be hard to learn AND enjoy this sim if this was going to always happen. i had feeling that maybe experience players would joing this stage of game to take up spots and not give a chance for new players to learn how to operate from some airports.

i want to try to see if my demo world experience would carry over to beginner world to see how i can do. i looking forward to trying the other game stages once i learn the sim on a larger way. hopefully sami will take me up on my offer to update some airports passenger demands so i can try to see my airline at home airport   

[LemonButt]

Yes, this is one thing that I have to keep an eye on. If these worlds become too much the playground of the "big and experienced", I have to re-impose some sort of restrictions to the next one.

As after all it is still supposed to be a beginner scenario, but with a "testing" ability for others too.

Sami--how about limiting Beginners World based on achievements?  For example, if you have more than x number/types of achievements, you can't base at level 5 airports, if you have more than y you can't base at level 4, etc.  The more achievements you have, the smaller the airport you have to go to in Beginners World.

[exchlbg]

I would have sworn exactly this was going to happen and Sami surely will have to alter that concept again. Most players don´t give a hack about the game concept, they want "success", and if it was against total newbies.

[Aerlingus1916]

I love the idea of this new BW, one thing bothers me though: the game is very short and it costs 5 credits to join, even though the last BW's was 4 times longer and just cost 3... Shouldn't it cost like 2 or at least 3 credits to join?

[SuriProf4]

I would have sworn exactly this was going to happen and Sami surely will have to alter that concept again. Most players don´t give a hack about the game concept, they want "success", and if it was against total newbies.

this would hurt the growth of the sim to new players. maybe sami does put restrictions but that would mean the testing of new strategies would only be done in the bigger game settings. i like the idea of experience players cannot operate the large airports. maybe make it the small airports only for them??

[Sami]

Yes well the game's short duration does keep players from getting too big and overwhelming over newbies, at least on some levels. But let's see how it goes.

[Lavo]

Not that I'm one of the heavy hitters, or anything, but, i've decided to base at WSSS, and i'm planning on building a quick profit base on a handful of shorthaul routes, so I can practice moving to 7 day scheduling, and getting into LH flights - something I've never managed to do successfully so far. I figure that's the next step in my AWS playing career!

I wanted somewhere with big demand so I wouldn't be hunting in the weeds for PAX. Admittedly, I'm less concerned with "fair play", as I am with "not trialling it in a real scenario", but given that it's the same cost as a real game world, I don't think I'm going against the spirit of the world?

I'd suggest that in future worlds the implementation of some of the previous points made, to stop genuine abuse?
1. lower cost - 5 credits entry fee (equal to other full worlds) means people will treat it exactly the same
2. have some automatic qualification levels that disqualify people from size 5 airports (I'd be happy be trialling this in a size 4 airport - though equally, I'm paying for the priviledge, so I'm certainly not going to feel "guilty" about basing at a 5)

Cheers

[alexgv1]

Lavo and others, this thread really isn't getting at players like you. You've barely been playing for half a year and your career is still young. I'm talking about big players from large alliances who have been playing for years and can run at large airports in regular worlds. I'm not gonna name names (of individuals or alliances) by the way. They know who they are and maybe their managers should have a word with them about how they're representing their alliance.

If it was to be regulated. Something like excluding players over one year from the top 50 airports by traffic rather than airport size. However the best solution is self regulation and playing within the spirit of the game.

Wishing all the young players starting at big airport the best of luck and I really hope you enjoy it and build your skills to tackle the larger worlds.

[NorgeFly]

I'm in the game but trying something very different from my normal airlines which is what the game is intended for.

[alexgv1]

I'm in the game but trying something very different from my normal airlines which is what the game is intended for.

Don't worry I don't think too many people are going to be upset over Manchester... Plus your airlines are never usually so big so I assumed that you were doing some kind of experiment (plus I trust that you are a moral player, whereas some other I do not  )

[brique]

I think its a temporary thing, older players haven't been allowed into BW, so 'experimental' airlines, to try out new ideas and strategies, haven't had a home, unless you BK  a lot in a standard game world... but that does only allow one shot at 'day1 start-up' experiments.

It will probably be less of an issue by the next BW as the excitement of 'new toys!' wears off a bit.

I do agree that the price is an issue : for experienced players maybe less so, but for newer players we are trying to entice into become regulars, it may be off-putting.

[alexgv1]

Yeah I was surprise at 5 cr instead of 2 (?) usually. But for such a short game I guess it's necessary.

Brique there will always be those players who are running an "experiment" at LHR/CDG... 

[LemonButt]

Yeah I was surprise at 5 cr instead of 2 (?) usually. But for such a short game I guess it's necessary.

Brique there will always be those players who are running an "experiment" at LHR/CDG... 

In all seriousness though, Beginners World is set to be so easy that ANY experiment should be successful.  You could probably build a fleet of 15-seaters that turns a profit or the elusive all-Russian metal airline.  The only exception might be an all-Concorde airline

[alexgv1]

In all seriousness though, Beginners World is set to be so easy that ANY experiment should be successful.  You could probably build a fleet of 15-seaters that turns a profit or the elusive all-Russian metal airline.  The only exception might be an all-Concorde airline

I thought about that last night. Although mine is more of a personal experiment I will probably analyse some feasibility of certain routes and aircraft. Then multiply my fuel costs by five or six and see if it would work in MT. And that is without competition 

[Sami]

exception might be an all-Concorde airline

Free beer for anyone doing Concorde-only airline, profitable, with 5+ planes.


Oh, and, no alliances because the game is so short that there's not much use for them (much hassle in the setup etc)

[brique]

True, with such soft settings you'll never get an accurate picture of how an experimental airline will function in a 'real' game-world : I've made an all-E110 outfit work in DOTM, (starting with 15-seaters; now have the newer 20-seat types flying), further evidence that the newish pricing model does benefit small-plane flyers.

I was considering trying for a Pilatus PC-12 fleet based somewhere familiar, just to see where the choke-points actually are in start-up/expansion mode, compared to my previous 30-seater outfits based there. Sanabas did some excellent work trying the mini-plane model out in the last MT(#7), I'd like to try it from Day-1, but I'll leave that until the next BW/Challenge.

[brique]

Free beer for anyone doing Concorde-only airline, profitable, with 5+ planes.

How much free beer?

[Sami]

A pint - to be collected at my place some friday evening