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Author Topic: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports  (Read 945 times)

Offline Jazza

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How can I be flying into Orly, France. Where demand is already more than well meet. This is my only route showing a Profitable Yeild. Yet Airports that have Passenger demand, equal too or more than the seats Im offering (Only me flying in there). Im loosing $10k+ on? The Demand is there, no competition, more than reduced prices, yet bugger all Punters? Much less than Routes im flying with competition! WTFIGO? What TF Is Going On? It makes no sense?

And while Im here, when are we going to get a Operating/Trust/Savings (bank) account? where a percentage of any profits can be deposited for safe keeping? There would be no airlines if this Financal accounting system was used!

Cheers,
Jazza

P.S. Sorry for the Rant!

Offline alexgv1

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2013, 10:31:57 AM »
I'm guessing your route images are still low?
CEO of South Where Airlines (SWA|WH)

Offline mtnlion

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2013, 01:02:01 PM »
It's probably the combination of low company image, route image and too high price. Just because there is demand does  not mean that people want to use your service.

Real life example. Company X offers "new direct flights" from Helsinki to Dusseldorf and the price is P. Company Y offers Helsinki-Dusseldorf via Copenhagen at price 0,75P and has had the same option for passengers for years.. The passenger is likely to choose company Y because of the lower price and the well known service ( even though it is not a direct flight ). The demand is still demand for the Hel-Dus flight.

Online NorgeFly

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2013, 01:18:48 PM »
I have noticed some odd results myself recently.

I opened two new routes of similar distance, similar demand and at exactly the same time (same aircraft) with 10% discounts on fares on both routes.

One route had competition and immediate load factors where around 40%. The other route had no competition and immediate load factors where around 20%.

But as time passes and RI grows (and thus I increase fares) the performance of both routes returns more to what I expected.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2013, 01:46:06 PM »
This phenomenon can be related to the fact, that your competitor because of his monopoly had his fares maxed out, while you were running on default or less. There the "compare fare"- decision kicks in, while there is no such on your other route.Although not coded, this would be also happening in real life, where people would get aware of a new competitor on an already known route faster than of an completely new connection with a completely new airline.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2013, 01:51:55 PM by exchlbg »

Offline schro

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2013, 01:57:13 PM »
The difference is the demand level between the cities. When you launch a route with a low RI, you can only get about 25-30% of total demand no matter what you do until RI improves. With respect to ORLY (ya rly, no wai), out of your base, there's 1000+ demand per day and you are flying a diesel 9, therefore, it is possible to get near full loads on that route out of the gate. For other routes, such as to STN, where there's 200/day demand and you are flying 100 of it, in theory, your top load factor will be about 50% out of the gate in the most optimal conditions.

Competition can impact your loads, but ultimately, if you are flying a single 100 seat plane on a 1000+ demand route, you will get a fairly full plane regardless of what your competition tries to do to you. Also, the shorter a route is, the more profitable it will be, because ticket prices do not scale linearly with miles flown, even though your variable costs do.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2013, 02:06:36 PM »
Thatīs an already known fact, but Norge Fly was talking of routes of similar demand, being competition the only difference.
I already noticed differences later in game, when my competiton left and I had the monopoly. I had to LOWER fares to keep my LF.
Reason could be that there is no other high fare to compare for the PAX any more, or their decision was now fixed to default.

brique

  • Former member
Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2013, 05:36:02 PM »
There is another aspect to competed routes : over-supplying seats with lower fares will create additional demand, (I believe its somewhere around 10-20%, there is a post somewhere from Sami giving the correct figure) attracted solely by the fares : once competition leaves, you'll not be over-supplying demand at anything like the previous level, so that extra demand fades away ; result is a smaller pool of potential pax to be dazzled by your fares and service.

I noticed this in one game recently, 3 of us competing on a route, but I was still getting reasonable loads at default pricing, then one BK-ed and the route was never as profitable again as I had to cut prices to keep that same share.

Offline Jazza

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2013, 10:53:13 AM »
Day 2, of 3rd reset. Left $6m in the bank, down to $4m after a few hours! And while serving demand for the seats and 0 competition, all LF in the RED. Except the one of the only ones with competition, Dublin.

Advertising to the Hilton/'Paris' and back. In my opinion, something is up with this game world? been playing for the last few years, only the 2nd or 3rd time I have had to reset. (all in this Game)  If AWS made just a few minor/semi major changes I would pay alot more to not have to deal with this! AWS could be alot more realistic, it has a way too go. I am a bit p***ed about it, but I'll leave my Micheal O'Leary face at home! I'll stick in there for now. I hope you guys/gals do too!

Maybe Paris is taking all my money

Online NorgeFly

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2013, 10:59:50 AM »
Day 2, of 3rd reset. Left $6m in the bank, down to $4m after a few hours! And while serving demand for the seats and 0 competition, all LF in the RED. Except the one of the only ones with competition, Dublin.

Advertising to the Hilton/'Paris' and back. In my opinion, something is up with this game world? been playing for the last few years, only the 2nd or 3rd time I have had to reset. (all in this Game)  If AWS made just a few minor/semi major changes I would pay alot more to not have to deal with this! AWS could be alot more realistic, it has a way too go. I am a bit p***ed about it, but I'll leave my Micheal O'Leary face at home! I'll stick in there for now. I hope you guys/gals do too!

Maybe Paris is taking all my money

You cannot expects to make money immediately, it takes time, especially for a brand new airline. My airline has CI of 70 and still new routes start within very low load factors and take time to mature.

Spending on marketing has to be balanced too, no point spending so much to speed things up that it eventually bankrupts you.

Offline schro

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2013, 12:45:04 PM »
Day 2, of 3rd reset. Left $6m in the bank, down to $4m after a few hours! And while serving demand for the seats and 0 competition, all LF in the RED. Except the one of the only ones with competition, Dublin.

Advertising to the Hilton/'Paris' and back. In my opinion, something is up with this game world? been playing for the last few years, only the 2nd or 3rd time I have had to reset. (all in this Game)  If AWS made just a few minor/semi major changes I would pay alot more to not have to deal with this! AWS could be alot more realistic, it has a way too go. I am a bit p***ed about it, but I'll leave my Micheal O'Leary face at home! I'll stick in there for now. I hope you guys/gals do too!

Maybe Paris is taking all my money

Please re-read my post above, as it addresses what you are raging about.

It will take 6-8 months for RI to reach 100, and that is when you can expect full loads on routes without competition. In the short term, a 20% price discount will help you until RI is up around 40, then you can boost it back to standard.

It is NORMAL to lose money during the first few weeks of operation, and you should keep some of your startup money to pay for that inevitability. If you leave it alone for a game month or two, you'll start profiting.

Offline mtnlion

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2013, 04:15:50 PM »
 
It will take 6-8 months for RI to reach 100, and that is when you can expect full loads on routes without competition. In the short term, a 20% price discount will help you until RI is up around 40, then you can boost it back to standard.

What? It does not take that long for the RI to reach 100. Or do you mean without marketing? With only newspaper marketing it reaches 100 in 3,5 months usually. If the route has competition it's wiser to capture the market as fast as possible.

Offline alexgv1

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Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2013, 04:53:10 PM »
Yeah of course 6 game months without marketing. Not many people bother with route marketing still, maybe a few more since the changes.
CEO of South Where Airlines (SWA|WH)

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Passenger Demand vs Load Factor, at un-serviced Cities/Airports
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2013, 08:58:55 PM »
Jazza, you donīt seem to be playing this game for years constantly, otherwise you wouldnīt complain about missing success from day one to day two ! Even without the last changes of demand model you should know that things evove slowly in here, anything else would be just unrealistic kiddie game world.And staying alive with game announcements and forum discussions you should have been warned that things had changed.Just set back to the biggest player value called patience and spend your game money wisely.

 

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