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Author Topic: Technical Stops  (Read 1043 times)

Offline Vanquo

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Technical Stops
« on: March 14, 2013, 05:47:00 PM »
I know this is a pretty open ended question but just how bad are they? I know costs can be mitigated by stopping at smaller airports, but do technical stops kill the profitability of a route?

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2013, 06:53:39 PM »
Technical stops are heavily punished in terms of attractiveness for PAX, especially when offered against non-stop service.
If your material in addition is too small for this route another drop of attractiveness will show.Together with the fact, that long routes loose profitability with rising fuel prices I would think twice considering it, especially in MT.

Offline TPMP

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2013, 04:41:39 PM »
Sorry to bring this old chestnut up again, but its something which I've never had to deal with before but I'm now considering it.

1) I understand that when offered against non-stop services that its not going to come off great. However, when offered with no other competition on the route I assume that it would do a lot better?

2) The routes I'm considering flying would be a maximum of 5000nm, but usually around 4000nm with demand varying from 150-190 pax. While Its not a huge amount, I think it may work, particularly with a decent business class demand.

3) That leads me on to a final question. Does the quality of seats have any affect on the price I can charge for tickets?..I.E. Could I charge more for a plane full of premium economy seats then I would for a plane full of standard economy seats?


Thanks in advance. :)

Offline Name_Omitted

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2013, 06:37:10 PM »
2) The routes I'm considering flying would be a maximum of 5000nm, but usually around 4000nm with demand varying from 150-190 pax. While Its not a huge amount, I think it may work, particularly with a decent business class demand.

I suspect this will not be the case.  IF you have nowhere else to expand, and IF you can own the aircraft outright, you can probably make a profit, but you will find that a long, thin route if we have a fuel shock.

Now, if we still had some of the old turbo-props, that could be something!  Bristol Britannia for the win!

Offline TPMP

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2013, 07:10:11 PM »
Really? You don't think it'll work? Its not an immediate plan as I'm a relatively new airline so there's still a bit of expansion to do first.

I certainly wouldn't own the planes outright anyway to begin with, so you think that's where I'd lose out financially on those routes? I'd love to be able to make them work!

Offline Name_Omitted

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2013, 08:21:06 PM »
A jet going 4k nm will spend around 10 hours in the air, one way.  This does not count the fuel cost of 2 take-offs (which this simulation DOES take into consideration).  You are running older 737's, and I am assuming you are not wanting to get any of the new generation (which could do the flight non-stop).  So, let's make it a '37-5, burning 2,490 kg per hour.

24k kg per hour per flight (not counting take-off or landing) at 689 per thousand kg of fuel is $16.5k in fuel alone, which will amount to over $80 per seat.  The price "last" May was 20% higher.  At that range, you are not getting much more flying in, so you will need to account for the full cost of the lease in that one flight a day.

It *is* doable, and it will give you routes that will likely not have competition (and great bragging rights), you just need to have enough more reliable fuel sipping birds (your ATR's work GREAT for that) to cushion the blow of a fuel spike.

Offline TPMP

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2013, 08:39:39 PM »
Thanks for that in-depth reply. I hadn't broken it down like that before. I had actually thought about going with the 752 because it's range is around 4k and it has a very low order backlog. I did consider the newer generation 737s (particularly the 737-700) but they are in such demand that I decided not to, for the time being at least. I'll look again at my generation of 737s and compare them to the 752. Certainly the 752 has better seat capacity.

Thanks again for the reply.

Offline knobbygb

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2013, 05:09:53 AM »
Quote
particularly the 737-700

I'd beware of those.  In the past I never really managed to make them work on long routes - even when owned outright and without a tech stop.  They're just too small really.  Mind you, that was before the new pricing model.  If you can be charging something like +40% of the 'standard' price, then it might be worth it.

Quote
3) That leads me on to a final question. Does the quality of seats have any affect on the price I can charge for tickets?

I'd really like a definitive answer to that one too. It SHOULD help and the conventional wisdom was always that it would, but has anyone actually done a proper controlled experiment?  Specifically on long or ultra-long haul routes where it would actually make a difference in real life.

Offline TPMP

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Re: Technical Stops
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2013, 02:07:02 PM »
Just to give an update, I've decided to go with the 752 on routes no more then 4knm which will enable me to do it non stop. Then, I will try the tech stops and see if I can make them work. :)

 

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