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Author Topic: Lack of used Aircraft  (Read 1311 times)

Online senorsoupe

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Lack of used Aircraft
« on: March 02, 2013, 05:43:28 PM »
This is the first time I have joined a game from the beginning and I noticed that there are very few used aircraft! I was hoping to increase my fleet but there are no used planes of the two types I have (ATR-42/72 and MD-80).  Is it normal for there to be a shortage of used planes at the beginning of the game?

Offline schro

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2013, 06:34:45 PM »
This is the first time I have joined a game from the beginning and I noticed that there are very few used aircraft! I was hoping to increase my fleet but there are no used planes of the two types I have (ATR-42/72 and MD-80).  Is it normal for there to be a shortage of used planes at the beginning of the game?

Yes, this is normal and tends to last at least a few game years....

Offline Infinity

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2013, 07:06:27 PM »
This is the first time I have joined a game from the beginning and I noticed that there are very few used aircraft! I was hoping to increase my fleet but there are no used planes of the two types I have (ATR-42/72 and MD-80).  Is it normal for there to be a shortage of used planes at the beginning of the game?

There are a lot of players right now all looking for used aircraft as ordering new aircraft as a brand new airline is one of the more stupid things to do. So a lot of things coming together resulting in this shortage. Just make sure to hit the broker regularly and you will eventually get lucky.

Offline Troxartas86

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2013, 12:24:57 AM »
Are you kidding? I've seen scenarios where there were literally less than 100 planes available, most of them useless. This market is filled to the brim with older birds that still have a couple of useful years left in them. You should be just fine flying some antiques the first year or two just to claim some routes. The only ones I'd stay away from are the 707s, they can be dangerous even in DoTM.

The 727 remained in use into the early 2000s and there are still DC-9s flying regular service in the US today. While fuel is below 1000 there's nothing to worry about.

Antob

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2013, 04:23:39 PM »
is it me or is the lack of used planes increasing?

Its difficult to get hold of anything decent  :'(

737Capt

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2013, 08:23:41 PM »
is it me or is the lack of used planes increasing?

Its difficult to get hold of anything decent  :'(
Not just you.  Unless you want to load your airline with a bunch of Russian aircraft that will destroy your company once fuel prices go up and maintenance is due!  There are no decent airplanes on the market.  Very frustrating when you start your airline with a couple of aircraft types because of the huge volume on the market only to find that type has vanished from the market.  Now you are stuck.  :'(

Offline Infinity

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2013, 08:36:55 PM »
Patience is a key to this game.

Offline Troxartas86

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2013, 04:39:43 AM »
Not just you.  Unless you want to load your airline with a bunch of Russian aircraft that will destroy your company once fuel prices go up and maintenance is due!  There are no decent airplanes on the market.  Very frustrating when you start your airline with a couple of aircraft types because of the huge volume on the market only to find that type has vanished from the market.  Now you are stuck.  :'(

Lies! I had 30 year old Tu-134s turning a profit at the end of DoTM4. The expenses also drop to near average levels in the post-Soviet generation of Russian birds. I have twice used the An-148/158 series to great success and had an ancient Tu-204 making half a million off a single flight in the last MT.

I'm currently running 20 year old DC-9s here in MT (which are quite abundant) and I'm rolling in cash. 13 birds in the air and my loan is paid off. My business model this time around calls for exclusive use of older allegedly expensive aircraft. In the real world MD-80s are still quite common and Delta still flies DC-9s. I know we don't have the benefit of ancillary fees but you can turn a profit with just about anything if you do it right. There are too many myths in this community.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2013, 07:10:49 AM »
Lies! I had 30 year old Tu-134s turning a profit at the end of DoTM4. The expenses also drop to near average levels in the post-Soviet generation of Russian birds. I have twice used the An-148/158 series to great success and had an ancient Tu-204 making half a million off a single flight in the last MT.

I'm currently running 20 year old DC-9s here in MT (which are quite abundant) and I'm rolling in cash. 13 birds in the air and my loan is paid off. My business model this time around calls for exclusive use of older allegedly expensive aircraft. In the real world MD-80s are still quite common and Delta still flies DC-9s. I know we don't have the benefit of ancillary fees but you can turn a profit with just about anything if you do it right. There are too many myths in this community.

Moral of the story: Think outside the A320.

Offline Kaskoblue

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2013, 07:42:19 AM »
So true... there are other options than A320. And the Russian planes are not That Bad (at this stage of the game).  I know, as (I believe) I am the only player in the game operating a fleet of 4 x Tu-154M (and 1 x MD82)! And it does work! Not that well, but I still survive.

Sure, it is in my long range plan to replace the Tupolevs with MD-80 series, if I can find them (and afford them), when C-checks start coming up in a few months time. However, if I can't find any decent MD:s, I'll go for old DC9 or B727Adv... not very sexy, but i'll probably work quite ok. And the lack of used a/c indeed makes the game much more challenging and interesting.

ReedME

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2013, 09:33:56 AM »
There are some real hawks out there, was looking into buying a 757 - checked the market. One available, opened it up decided I liked it, realised I was 100k short of the lease price. Knew the day was ending in about 15 minutes, came back with the extra cash. GONE!

w0tha

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2013, 09:52:25 AM »
Seems like a bunch of 737-200adv's just jumped back onto the market after only being 1 there earlier today!

Nicholas1992

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2013, 05:41:34 PM »
I find it stupid.

I have an airline, i started soon as the game went live and straight onto the ORD-LHR. Just so i could at least get a slot pair at LHR (something should be done about this). Now i'm stuck with no where to turn. I can expand, i've got another aircraft on order however that isn't coming until 1998 (2 years game time). Thats due to the order backog, which is completely stupid. One airline hogging all the slots for the next 3 years how is this fair?!

Not only this there is lack of used aircraft so i cant do anything its a circle.

- Enough money to lease and just enough to buy - No aircraft on used and massive backlog on new orders - turning over on one route one aircarft - back to the other end.

Offline Sami

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2013, 05:58:17 PM »
Okay...

You say it is stupid that you do not have an unlimited access to aircraft, or what was the point?

You say it is stupid that it takes 2 game years to get certain new aircraft. The order queues are built in realistic manner - they have to actually build them (virtually), the new planes cannot appear out of thin air within months. (I would suggest to try some other model than the most popular 737 or A320 series by the way - this is a general tip for everyone.. MD-90 or -80 works just as fine for example.). The place in queue depends when you ordered the aircraft, and nobody can jump the queue.

And you say that one airline is hogging slots for the next 3 years..? Well, that isn't true either, as everyone has the same chance to get the slots.


You have played for two real weeks of the game and have only still one single aircraft, so I'm sorry but you are doing it wrong (ordering a single new aircraft that takes time to be delivered - the delivery times were presented when ordering by the way! - is not a smart move when you have only 1 single plane in the fleet). Well of course you CAN do it this way too but getting new planes with such a limited income base just WILL get you into this "waiting game" since you have very limited resources (income). As the beginner guides etc explain, it is best to stick to used planes to get started. Though as important is the fleet selection, but if you have 10x DC-9 and 1x B767 for example, there's no problem.

I don't know what your strategy is in long term but you have currently $15 mil cash available and the used market has literally dozens or hundreds of planes available, albeit old such as 747-200 or Tristar, but they will get you started as well as the brand-spanking new A330 or 777. Lots of short range planes there too (you can lease 15 DC-9s with this money!), and they may be the safer choice to get started actually...
« Last Edit: March 16, 2013, 06:05:01 PM by sami »

Online ZombieSlayer

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2013, 08:44:54 PM »
Sami: 1, Noob: 0  :laugh:
Co-Founder Elite Worldwide Alliance
CEO PacAir
Designated "Tier 1 Opponent"

Offline Troxartas86

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2013, 08:55:41 PM »
I just pulled up the used market and there are 856 planes listed which I believe is a number much higher than zero. The only ones I'd avoid are the dozen or so 707s that haven't been scrapped yet and of course the Il-62 with its insane fuel consumption. That still leaves over 800 choices, all of them viable for getting started depending on what you want to do. The full range from 9-seat turboprops to 300+ seat jumbos are all there for the taking.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2013, 09:29:35 PM »
Being a noob I would think twice starting at airports like ORD or LHR, they get slot congested soon.There are so many other options where to start and where to fly to, but if you insist on playing the big game from day one  -  take the consequences, and look whom you are naming stupid.

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2013, 09:32:56 PM »
Being a noob I would think twice starting at airports like ORD or LHR, they get slot congested soon.There are so many other options where to start and where to fly to, but if you insist on playing the big game from day one  -  take the consequences, and look whom you are naming stupid.

Yeah, noob airline at a top 10, top 20 airport is generally a suicide...

As far as lack of aircraft, DC-9 is not a bad desperation aircraft.  It can earn enough money for ordering its replacement...

ReedME

  • Former member
Re: Lack of used Aircraft
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2013, 09:35:58 PM »
Naw isn't it cute when people can't get their boeings and airbuses !

 

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