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Author Topic: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics  (Read 2958 times)

brique

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #40 on: August 19, 2012, 09:46:50 PM »
I agree, broadly, with your view on this specific case, having now heard from FlyTO on the matter.

But it is pass the parcel, and it doesn't really matter whether the last person held it for 7 days or 7 yrs, its the one holding it on the due day who gets the full bill to pay, and does not necessarily then get the full value of paying that bill.

And, of course, nobody wants to be the one holding the parcel on that day so folk are gonna scheme to avoid it, same way we scheme to avoid paying taxes... and some of those ways will be 'clever', and some downright 'evil'... and everything in-between.

Offline Kadachiman

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #41 on: August 20, 2012, 08:42:10 AM »
I took a look at FLY : the airline which leased this a/c : most odd : if it is the same airline, 14 days old, it has no aircraft, no routes, no income, $1.5mil in cash and a 'B' credit rating : and a 737-600 ordered on a lease due for delivery in 3 game-years time..

the faint whiff of fishiness occureth...



This is the most concerning part of the whole thread....and most seem to have missed this point.
What is to stop a CEO creating another airline, leasing his own plane, perfotming D check and B/K...a big windfall for the original airline.
I wonder if Sami checks IP addresses in this case?


I have 3 x aircraft leased out for 6.4 years due to be handed back to me just prior to their D checks, but I see this as astute business by the airline CEO that leased them from me.

Offline Infinity

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    • Aviation Awareness
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #42 on: August 20, 2012, 10:24:16 AM »
I doubt anyone would be stupid enough to spend real money (as in credits) to outsource D-checks. Nobody can be that thick. If he is, he would be such a pathetic wretch that he'd rather deserve our pity than anything else.
But let's not jump to conclusions, should be easy for sami to check.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #43 on: August 20, 2012, 10:43:42 AM »
I donīt know if I got that right: you assume someone is opening a second airline in a game world?
How should that be possible ? You need a second account. That is strictly forbidden and leeds to prompt closure of all accounts.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #44 on: August 20, 2012, 11:35:21 AM »
I doubt anyone would be stupid enough to spend real money (as in credits) to outsource D-checks. Nobody can be that thick. If he is, he would be such a pathetic wretch that he'd rather deserve our pity than anything else.
But let's not jump to conclusions, should be easy for sami to check.

Bad idea.  Dumb dumb dumb

Offline jewiden

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #45 on: August 20, 2012, 11:40:00 AM »
I doubt anyone would be stupid enough to spend real money (as in credits) to outsource D-checks. Nobody can be that thick. If he is, he would be such a pathetic wretch that he'd rather deserve our pity than anything else.
But let's not jump to conclusions, should be easy for sami to check.
If it can give an advantage, someone will. There's a reason there's "farms" of WoW goldminers China/Korea and such.
In other words: People who can afford it, can and will throw money at the problem.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #46 on: August 20, 2012, 12:37:02 PM »
If it can give an advantage, someone will. There's a reason there's "farms" of WoW goldminers China/Korea and such.
In other words: People who can afford it, can and will throw money at the problem.

Sami tracks people who log in from similar IPs.  Continuing down this discussion path will not yield any benefits.

Offline Tom14cat14

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #47 on: August 20, 2012, 02:04:00 PM »
In my opinion this is just good business. It is not his fault someone leases his aircraft with a d check about to be due. People do not have to lease it if they do not like the deal. We are not here to hold everyone's hands. If you read the manual it states you need to be mindful of maintenance checks and leasing terms. These are some pretty basic things to look at to run a business.
APB Airlines

Offline FlyTO

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #48 on: August 20, 2012, 03:05:00 PM »
This is the most concerning part of the whole thread....and most seem to have missed this point.
What is to stop a CEO creating another airline, leasing his own plane, perfotming D check and B/K...a big windfall for the original airline.
I wonder if Sami checks IP addresses in this case?


I have 3 x aircraft leased out for 6.4 years due to be handed back to me just prior to their D checks, but I see this as astute business by the airline CEO that leased them from me.


Wait a second, are YOU implying that I am doing that or anyone in general?!?! Because if you are implying that I, Myself am doing that, I am deeply offended.

I do agree it's a stupid idea for someone to do that, but to avoid a measly 1.7M D-check and risk being banned FOREVER is not that great really.

The previous aircraft was just leased for one year, no d-check was performed, and the airline BK'ed. Is that my fault? I don't think so. Btw, that aircraft was later sold to someone called 'EsquireFlyer' if you must know.

And I still don't think there was anything obnoxious or wrong in doing that. It's basically used as a storage, and if someone leases or buys your plane, then great, make some money, if not, it's not the end of the world either. Same with selling an aircraft for its max price, if someone buys it, then great, if not, it doesn't really matter, it's just to avoid the costs associated with leaving in your fleet and not flying. How hard is that to comprehend?

Being an airline CEO is to make profits and cut costs, is that not correct?

Now please, leave my airline alone, I am happy I finally had a good strategy in growing a profitable airline for once!

Offline EsquireFlyer

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2012, 06:48:05 PM »
The previous aircraft was just leased for one year, no d-check was performed, and the airline BK'ed. Is that my fault? I don't think so. Btw, that aircraft was later sold to someone called 'EsquireFlyer' if you must know.

Oh, hey, thanks for bringing me into it again. You reposted your plane with the expired D check, but this time allowed purchase, so that the buyer could at least get the value of the D check for the remaining service life of the plane. I have stated upthread that I believe this to be a fair practice, so, true to my word, I bought the plane and I am D-checking it.

But now that you bring it up, no, it doesn't change my opinion that putting a plane with an expired/near-expired D check up for lease only, at a big markup, and capped for 1 year, is an obnoxious tactic. Nor does it change the fact that you received a windfall of millions of dollars by instantly bankrupting a newbie airline with your original lease posting.

Being an airline CEO is to make profits and cut costs, is that not correct?
A slum lord could also use the same defense to justify charging low-income tenants huge "maintenance" fees while refusing to make basic repairs to the aparments leased by the tenants (hey, if someone is willing to live in the rat infested apartment without hot water, it can't be so bad, right?). But it wouldn't change the fact that the slum lord's behavior is wrong, and in most states probably illegal.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #50 on: August 20, 2012, 07:53:54 PM »
This is going too far now. Airplane leasing between companies can in no way be compared to leasing an apartment. Tenants in many countries are protected by law. Commercial leasers of retail space are not, as well as there is the freedom of contract in many western law systems.
I think you stated your opinion and now should leave it to the rest of the community to make up itīs own.
There are rules of fair play in this game mostly involving deliberately targeting an airline into BK.
Offering crappy aircafts to whoever wanting to lease it doesnīt target anybody personally. And if the lease of just one aircraft draws an unexperienced noobie into BK, itīs his lesson, I assume that company wouldnīt have made it anyway.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2012, 07:56:36 PM by exchlbg »

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #51 on: August 21, 2012, 12:09:59 AM »
Because snow melts I AM ANGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #52 on: August 21, 2012, 12:14:45 AM »
Now thatīs really obnoxious ! >:(

Offline FlyTO

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  • Posts: 260
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #53 on: August 21, 2012, 12:17:07 AM »
In other news... CEO of FlyTO may consider rebranding its tarnished image of an airline to something more respectable...

Perhaps, Pan Canadian Slum Transport Air.... or even something less original and borderline illegal, Air CanWest JetPorter.

exchlbg

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #54 on: August 21, 2012, 12:19:40 AM »
LEASE TO KILL Airlines ?

Offline LemonButt

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #55 on: August 21, 2012, 12:23:08 AM »
Y'all sure wasted a lot of time and energy on this thread...

Offline ARASKA

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #56 on: August 21, 2012, 12:24:29 AM »
this has gone far enough...

Talentz

  • Former member
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #57 on: August 21, 2012, 12:43:31 AM »
Perhaps, Pan Canadian Slum Transport Air....

Given the progress and current status of EsquireFlyer's airline in NAC, I'd say he has a strong understand of game mechanics and thus, if you were based against him at the start a game world.. you wouldn't be such a big airline  ;)


In any case I agree. I call upon the great forum powers of Sigma. Awaken great King Ceasar Sigma! Come to our aid!!

*Plays on speakers* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iXGMp7ZkF0

Talentz
« Last Edit: August 21, 2012, 01:13:35 AM by Talentz »

Offline ARASKA

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Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #58 on: August 21, 2012, 12:59:23 AM »
Given the progress and current status of EsquireFlyer's airline in NAC, I'd say he has a strong understand of game mechanics and thus, if you were based against in at the start a game world.. you wouldn't be such a big airline  ;)


In any case I agree. I call upon the great forum powers of Sigma. Awaken great King Ceasar Sigma! Come to our aid!!

*Plays on speakers* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iXGMp7ZkF0

Talentz
and also considering the fact that it's only his 4th full game...

Offline Sigma

  • Members
  • Posts: 1920
Re: Obnoxious Plane Broker Tactics
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2012, 01:43:25 AM »
In any case I agree. I call upon the great forum powers of Sigma. Awaken great King Ceasar Sigma! Come to our aid!!

*Plays on speakers* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3iXGMp7ZkF0

Talentz

I was more than half-expecting to get rick-rolled when I clicked on that. ;)

I agree, I think this thread has run its course.  I do think that the points raised are valid, but perhaps just a teensy bit too personal to continue.  

And I'll leave that to sami to decide whether he wants to make any improvements to the notification of upcoming maintenance.  I would expect him to lean towards the belief that the existing warnings are sufficient, but perhaps something a bit more explicit could be done to decrease the likelihood of accidents occurring by newbies.   I think that a notification rather than a fixed mechanic would work the best -- it still allows FlyTo (and others) to do what they did (which, is perfectly valid), still allows other players to take advantage of the leasing offer (if it really is economical, which I doubt), but reduces the likelihood of someone accidentally getting into a deal they weren't expecting to (and disenchanting newbies isn't good for anyone)

 

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