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Author Topic: How come I am no longer making any money?  (Read 1824 times)

Offline philkirk99

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How come I am no longer making any money?
« on: January 10, 2012, 05:13:19 AM »
For the past 2 real time days, my money seems tp have remained static at about 1,000,000

What am I doing wrong? So far, I've done OK, my routes are ALL showing a profit on them and up until now, I have built up enough cash to order 22 x A330s, 16 x A340s, 28 x A320s and these will be delivered between 1998 and 2005.

However, for the past 48 hours (real time), my cash figure just seems to go up and down a little bit but stay around the 1,000,000 without much fluctuation?

Am I missing something completely? This is the first time I've played MT from the start and anyone's suggestions would be gratefully received.

Thanks
Philkirk99
CEO Philmark Airlines

vitongwangki

  • Former member
Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2012, 05:16:59 AM »
Clearly the 747-200 is no longer making money, you can check by yourself are they making money under this fuel price.

Moreover, this game is not guaranteed to make money, even you made a lot of orders before. If you have played MT5 or other gameworld, you could some big airline meven with 400 planes, could fall.

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2012, 04:11:12 PM »
this game is not guaranteed to make money

What do you mean????? Im not guaranteed to make money???
I demand a refund to my credits!

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2012, 04:29:05 PM »
I appreciate that as the fuel prices rise, my B747-200 will not make as much money as previously but ......

If I check under ROUTES/MANAGE ROUTES - every single route is making money.

If I check under MY AIRCRAFT - every single aircraft is making money.

And yet now, it has been 3 real time days and my money is still NOT going up AT ALL ..... what am I missing or not understanding?

Offline eiva

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2012, 04:58:44 PM »
You have to remember that you also have fixed costs like salaries, marketing etc. These costs are not included in the figures for your routes and for each aircraft.

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2012, 05:33:30 PM »
Hi Elva - thanks for your input - appreciate it.

However, I think I understand what you are saying because if I look under each aircraft individually, in the bottom left hand corner is the information concerning revenue - costs (similar to what I have copied below).

Values show the actual profit/loss of the aircraft including all fees and payments.
Profit yesterday   130 621 USD
Cumulative profit this week    0 USD
Cumulative profit last week   725 212 USD (so my aircraft had a profit last week)

The sums are an estimate of next week's incomes based on previous day.
Sold tickets   2 038 776 USD
Line maintenance (A+B)   -23 326 USD
Insurance   -97 647 USD
Fuel cost   -283 164 USD
Route fees (1)   -249 720 USD
Weekly leasing cost   -688 326 USD
Total   696 593 USD (and my aircraft will have a projected profit next week)
(1) Includes landing, passenger, handling and navigation fees.


If EVERY aircraft shows a profit under this section as well (which they are), what else could be the problem??

MatthijsTissen

  • Former member
Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2012, 05:40:42 PM »
fleet commonality could be the problem. Because you have 2 767 and 2 a330. Now still if there making more than 500,000 per week they could generate losses because of you have just 2 of them. I had that problem to.
This hasn't anything to deal specifically with the 742's. That would be my guess...

Offline ArcherII

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2012, 05:43:34 PM »
Does not count overall maintenance costs (not A or B checks), crew costs, and other overall overhead costs such as staff training, marketing, entire personnel costs, rent etc. Granted, overhead costs are paid by your entire fleet, but for a plane of that size, it should generate more to make overall profit. To know how much profit you're making, you just take the weekly profit from the income statement and divide it by your number of airplanes (entire fleet). You'll get an average of profit from all the airplanes. I believe that a 742 should earn nearly 1,5mil to make it even, where an A333 could be done with 800k.

Offline Sami

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2012, 06:06:49 PM »
Actually, you are making money.

See income statement week 17 for example. Three million plus. Next week was a loss overall since you made a four million loan payment.

Without the financing costs (loans, bank fees), the operational profit looks to be about one to three million per week over a longer term. But with some fluctuations in maintenance some weeks are tighter or a loss (had a C or D check I guess).

http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Office/Incomes/?view=1&graph=Sub1
http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Office/Incomes/?view=1&graph=Sub2
« Last Edit: January 10, 2012, 06:10:30 PM by sami »

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2012, 06:35:03 PM »
Hi Archer II - cheers for your input. I had no idea that was how you could work things out. However, that still leaves me a little confused. My last week's income was $39,025,760 and with 34 aircraft in my fleet, that means an average of $1,147,816 per aircraft.

So, theoretically, what you are telling me is that my 747s are basically not making money in the long term but other aircraft in my fleet such as the A320/A330/A340 might be.

And Sami, yes I did pay of 4,000,000 of a loan but that's the 1st time in 3 days I've been able to do anything like that whereas before, I paid off my loans a lot faster than that.

Offline JMsoo

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2012, 07:03:59 PM »
I have the same issue now... not generating profit since 2 real days! I stupidly lease 2 Boeing 747D because there were newly built but I cant maximise their load factor I'm investigating if this the issue, I would like to lease them out ASAP!! probably I will have to get a loan! I have 48 planes yet to arrive hopefully it will improve my situation! plus now I'm facing high concurrence and I had to drop price :-\

don't know and lets see   
African Airline International...Your Place on Sky...

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2012, 08:08:43 PM »
I'm glad I'm not the only one JMsoo but sorry you are having the problem as well !!

Offline ArcherII

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2012, 11:50:55 PM »
Hi Archer II - cheers for your input. I had no idea that was how you could work things out. However, that still leaves me a little confused. My last week's income was $39,025,760 and with 34 aircraft in my fleet, that means an average of $1,147,816 per aircraft.

So, theoretically, what you are telling me is that my 747s are basically not making money in the long term but other aircraft in my fleet such as the A320/A330/A340 might be.

And Sami, yes I did pay of 4,000,000 of a loan but that's the 1st time in 3 days I've been able to do anything like that whereas before, I paid off my loans a lot faster than that.

I was more talking about weekly profits against number of planes, it's just a gauge.
You shouldn't underestimate the power of fleet commonality, because running 6 different fleets in only 34 total aircrafts is only going to hurt medium term. And the 747-200 are indeed marginal with these fuel prices and we only know they're going up. I would suggest to dispose of the 742 and if you can't get more 767, then get rid of them aswell no matter how efficient they are, they are just adding a lot of expenses to the maitenance department (specific crews...check, specific A&Ps....check, specific spares....check - all that cost a lot of money if not streamlined within a greater number of planes within a fleet).

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2012, 04:52:15 AM »
Why dont you paste your income statement and fleet commonality page on the thread for us to see and make comments on it?  ;)

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2012, 06:07:13 PM »
Cheers guys and thanks for your help. Really do appreciate it .... I want to learn about this game and will take all your comments on board seriously.

Here’s my income statement :

You can see company's financial balance and details of incomes and expenses from this page. Click on the icon image to view a graphical presentation of the selected income sheet item.
•   Weekly view
•   Monthly view
•   Quarterly view
•   Yearly view
            
    Sold tickets (economy)   30 203 522 USD   36 906 684 USD   35 702 532 USD   32 805 028 USD
    Sold tickets (business)     5 324 776 USD     6 247 552 USD     6 113 107 USD     5 690 705 USD
    Sold tickets (first)       760 557 USD       833 530 USD       832 506 USD       800 538 USD
    Sold aircraft                        0 USD                0 USD                0 USD                0 USD
    Aircraft lease income                0 USD                0 USD                0 USD                0 USD
                                36 288 855 USD   43 987 766 USD   42 648 145 USD   39 296 271 USD

    Office rent                      -130 755 USD      -130 515 USD      -128 756 USD      -118 202 USD
    Fuel                            -7 320 098 USD   -8 551 425 USD   -8 298 312 USD   -7 671 807 USD
    Staff salaries            -2 077 955 USD   -2 077 955 USD   -2 074 519 USD   -2 020 931 USD
    Staff training            -1 893 609 USD   -1 892 307 USD   -1 829 840 USD   -1 829 420 USD
    Marketing                    -3 630 963 USD   -3 628 464 USD   -3 625 965 USD   -3 593 002 USD
    Passenger fees            -2 310 307 USD   -2 834 369 USD   -2 773 923 USD   -2 550 101 USD
    Navigation fees            -2 150 018 USD   -2 536 679 USD   -2 475 113 USD   -2 238 597 USD
    Landing fees               -924 733 USD   -1 100 808 USD   -1 099 014 USD   -1 001 535 USD
    Ground handling               -651 399 USD      -780 953 USD     -790 298 USD      -712 789 USD
    Aircraft maintenance    -2 655 526 USD   -3 031 822 USD   -4 284 913 USD   -4 169 747 USD
    Aircraft insurance            -1 744 566 USD   -2 041 032 USD   -1 976 401 USD   -1 929 689 USD
    Aircraft leases            -7 780 200 USD   -8 965 495 USD   -8 879 822 USD   -8 633 156 USD
    Purchased aircraft                 0 USD                0 USD                0 USD                0 USD
    Alliance fees               -439 878 USD      -426 481 USD      -392 963 USD      -430 344 USD
    Fines                                         0 USD                0 USD                0 USD                0 USD
                                -33 710 007 USD   -37 998 305 USD   -38 629 839 USD   -36 899 320 USD

    Loan payments            -4 068 537 USD       -68 305 USD        -68 074 USD    -8 684 155 USD
    Bank fees                       -214 959 USD       -14 959 USD        -14 959 USD       -443 649 USD
    Interest                        -53 054 USD      -53 286 USD        -53 517 USD        -82 993 USD
    Income tax withheld (35%)         0 USD   -7 165 337 USD                 0 USD                 0 USD
Result                            -4 336 550 USD   -7 301 887 USD       -136 550 USD     -9 210 797 USD


    Result                    -1 757 702 USD   -1 312 426 USD      3 881 756 USD     -6 813 846 USD


And here’s my fleet commonality :

Each aircraft type that your company operates costs you in terms of crew salaries and training. Each separate aircraft type must also have specific spare parts and trained maintenance personnel. There are also small administrative costs for keeping the aircraft manuals, procedures and other paperwork updated.
Each aircraft type you operate has fixed monthly costs that you can view from this page. To make your company as economical as possible try to keep the number of different aircraft types to a minimum.
Also the number of engine variants affect the total maintenance costs of your aircraft. You can also view the engine models you have installed from this page.
   
Airbus A318/A319/A320/A321
Number of aircraft in fleet   9
Administrative costs / month   136 043 USD
Fixed maintenance costs / month   653 476 USD
Crew training / month   983 174 USD
Total   1 772 693 USD
Airbus A330/A340
Number of aircraft in fleet   6
Administrative costs / month   196 706 USD
Fixed maintenance costs / month   1 068 327 USD
Crew training / month   1 476 415 USD
Total   2 741 448 USD
15 aircraft made by Airbus.

   
Boeing 747-100/200/300
Number of aircraft in fleet   12
Administrative costs / month   268 147 USD
Fixed maintenance costs / month   2 089 509 USD
Crew training / month   3 095 581 USD
Total   5 453 237 USD
Boeing 747-400/-8
Number of aircraft in fleet   7
Administrative costs / month   245 306 USD
Fixed maintenance costs / month   1 675 415 USD
Crew training / month   2 070 652 USD
Total   3 991 373 USD
Boeing 767-200/300/400
Number of aircraft in fleet   2
Administrative costs / month   197 045 USD
Fixed maintenance costs / month   868 441 USD
Crew training / month   520 427 USD
Total   1 585 913 USD
21 aircraft made by Boeing.

   
CFM56 series engines
CFM56-5C4
Number of aircraft in fleet   4
Number of engines in fleet   16
Models using engines   Airbus A330/A340
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / CFM56   200 941 USD
4 aircraft are using CFM International engines.

   
CF6 series engines
CF6-80E1
Number of aircraft in fleet   2
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Airbus A330/A340
CF6-50E2
Number of aircraft in fleet   1
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
CF6-80C2B1
Number of aircraft in fleet   7
Number of engines in fleet   28
Models using engines   Boeing 747-400/-8
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / CF6   466 132 USD
10 aircraft are using General Electric engines.

   
V2500 series engines
V2527-A5
Number of aircraft in fleet   9
Number of engines in fleet   18
Models using engines   Airbus A318/A319/A320/A321
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / V2500   159 768 USD
9 aircraft are using International Aero Engines engines.

   
PW4000 series engines
PW4056
Number of aircraft in fleet   2
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Boeing 767-200/300/400
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / PW4000   120 232 USD
JT9D series engines
JT9D-7F
Number of aircraft in fleet   1
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
JT9D-7J
Number of aircraft in fleet   1
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
JT9D-7Q
Number of aircraft in fleet   6
Number of engines in fleet   24
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
JT9D-7R4
Number of aircraft in fleet   2
Number of engines in fleet   8
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / JT9D   643 159 USD
12 aircraft are using Pratt & Whitney engines.

   
RB211 series engines
RB211-524D4
Number of aircraft in fleet   1
Number of engines in fleet   4
Models using engines   Boeing 747-100/200/300
 
Fixed maintenance costs / month / RB211   142 913 USD
1 aircraft is using Rolls-Royce engines.


Offline schro

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2012, 07:12:55 PM »
1. You're making money. In 2 of the weeks, you had big loan payments and in another you had an income tax payment.

2. Your fuel costs are high compared to revenue. I'd attribute this to the 747s.

3. Your leasing costs are high compared to revenue. I'd attribute this to the 747s and 767s.

4. What is your average utilization? Average load factors?

5. You might want to consider slowing down the loan payments and buy out some of the planes you intend on keeping to help lower your leasing costs, which will give you a lot more flexibility in the profitability arena....

Offline philkirk99

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #16 on: January 11, 2012, 08:39:57 PM »
Cheers schro for your suggestions.

I know the 747s are hurting me a little (they will a lot more later on I know) but they were the only thing I could get my hands on originally !!! I couldn't sit at the computer 24/7 at the beginning of the game, waiting for the right 2nd hand aircraft to turn up, like some people were able to do.

I only have 5,500,000 of the loan left to repay but will definitely look at buying out some of the aircraft I will be keeping - thanks for that suggestion. I have about another 12 x A320s on order for delivery in 2001/2 and I might change the payments on these from lease to purchase, prior to delivery. Is this a possible sensible option?

My aircraft utilisation is an average of 14.1hrs (257th in the league table of airlines) and my average load factor is 73.2% (238th in the league table of airlines), so I can see that both of those need to be improved upon.

I had ordered 9 new B748-400 to replace some of the older B747-200 that I had in service as I noticed that the fuel consumption of the B747-400 was about 60% of the B747-200 but with a marginally higher capacity,. However, what I didn't take into account (or couldn't actually figure out at the time), was that the saving I would make in fuel consumption was actually CONSIDERABLY LESS than the EXTRA cost of leasing the newer aircraft. So on a typical route operated by that aircraft type, the fuel cost dropped by about $150,000 a week which was great but the lease cost went up by about $300,000 !!! This is definitely one of the lessons I have learnt the hard way  :-\

Thanks again for getting back to me anyway with your suggestions/ideas/thoughts  :)

Offline schro

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #17 on: January 11, 2012, 09:09:47 PM »
I only have 5,500,000 of the loan left to repay but will definitely look at buying out some of the aircraft I will be keeping - thanks for that suggestion. I have about another 12 x A320s on order for delivery in 2001/2 and I might change the payments on these from lease to purchase, prior to delivery. Is this a possible sensible option?

Couple things before buying -

1. At your airline's current stage, before buying, make sure you have a strong orders pipeline for new planes if you plan on continuing to expand. 12x A320s means you'll get about a 9 month flow of them - if the wait is longer than 9 months for your next order, you need to go ahead and get in line at least to the extent there's a plane production backlog so you're not left waiting on more planes to show up.

2. Once you have your planes ordered, I would not convert ordered planes from lease to buy because you won't get any benefit of putting that money to use in plane ownership until it is delivered. Given that you hvae to make finance changes 10+ months out, its a poor use of cash unless you've got nothing better to do with it.

3. I generally buy out planes that I have leased when they are coming up on the end of their lease cycle (as you have to pay a penalty for early lease termination).  This would be the best way to go if you've got spare cash, and it will also help you with tax planning - by truing up your total profit to $0 at year end, you'll get all your tax payments back in a refund.

4. A321's offer rather superior economics to A320s especially if you have enough demand where you're flying to support them.

My aircraft utilisation is an average of 14.1hrs (257th in the league table of airlines) and my average load factor is 73.2% (238th in the league table of airlines), so I can see that both of those need to be improved upon.

Overall, those numbers aren't great unless for the load factor you've got heavy competition on every route you're flying (I find it to be unlikely).

Utilization is difficult to make a quick judgement without seeing a scheduling page or even knowing the types of routes that your'e flying, but I think your biggest concern is revenue generation rather than expenses - if you can increase your loads to 83%, your total profit (not considering loan repayment/taxes) will TRIPLE, as every extra passenger is effectively profit to you.

For the 747s, I would consider looking at the 7 day scheduling concept if you are flying them farther than 3000nm each way as that will help you maximize their utilization and revenue potential. For short haul, try to have planes do a red-eye overnight and short hops during the day to push up their utilization. It'd be awesome if you could get that number up to 16 hours.

Of course, other pro-tips -

1. No flights arriving/taking off between 00:00-04:55.
2. Don't schedule flights to the same destination too close together
3. Avoid competition if you're trying to increase profits with limited planes.
4. When planes are limited, consider pulling them off of a marginally profitable route and putting them on one with less competition/more profit potential.
5. Reprice to standard pricing on a regular basis (at least 2x per game year)

icelord

  • Former member
Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #18 on: January 11, 2012, 10:06:03 PM »
Hi philkirk99

my 2 cents:

- Drop the marketing costs
- Replace B747-100-200-300 as soon as possible with the -400. On used market you can find easily some AC ready to fly
- replace 767 with A330 to cut off one AC type

See my income statement (I've a lot of AC in C maintenance, doh!)

Offline schro

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Re: How come I am no longer making any money?
« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2012, 04:56:55 AM »
Hi philkirk99

my 2 cents:

- Drop the marketing costs
- Replace B747-100-200-300 as soon as possible with the -400. On used market you can find easily some AC ready to fly
- replace 767 with A330 to cut off one AC type

See my income statement (I've a lot of AC in C maintenance, doh!)

I'll have to disagree with a few of your points -

Marketing costs - In a highly competitive game a 90-100 CI is quite important to obtain early and maintain, but to do this, it takes about 10% of revenue to acheive that level, thus, I would say his marketing costs are in line and should ONLY be cut if its between that and bankruptcy.

747s - In an MT scenario, the 741/2/3s should just be sent away to be replaced by anything other than more 747s. Once a fuel spike shows up, its game over for anyone flying a significant number of ANY type of 747 unless the fleet is fully owned.

Fleet types - Yes, fleet types need to be dropped but based on his income statement, I think his biggest issue is revenue and not necessarily costs. For the costs that are high, they aren't necessarily related to fleet commonality... yet. By handling the fuel and leasing cost issues, fleet commonality should sort itself out without even thinking about it.

As far as your income statement, your fuel numbers are pretty reasonable but your lease costs for your revenue are out of control in comparison. Without having any insight into the game world, this tells me you're flying a new fleet of narrow bodies on short haul routes many times per day. The other possibility is that you leased a few planes that week to skew the numbers.

 

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