AirwaySim
Online Airline Management Simulation
Login
Username
Password
 
or login using:
 
My Account
Username:
E-mail:
Edit account
» Achievements
» Logout
Game Credits
Credit balance: 0 Cr
Buy credits
» Credit history
» Credits FAQ

Author Topic: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?  (Read 2876 times)

Wizard

  • Former member
Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« on: October 18, 2011, 08:19:07 PM »
I wonder about the AW 650, with its long range of around 1300 Nm.
This allows routs like London - Athen or London - Bucharest.

But for what routes was this a/c in real life used? I couldnt find sometihing about that in the web.

tia
-chris-

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

  • Members
  • Posts: 4028
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2011, 09:54:11 PM »
It is/was a cargo aircraft. :)

Offline swiftus27

  • Members
  • Posts: 4395
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2011, 10:08:44 PM »
People are self loading freight, so there you go.

Wizard

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2011, 07:26:05 AM »
So far, i only found a video about NZ's SAFE AIR, using it for servicing Chatham Island, for freight and PAX, by installing a 'Pessenger Capsule' with 747 Seats, Stewardesses, but no windows.. must be strange flights, uh?

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

  • Members
  • Posts: 4028
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2011, 08:32:12 AM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armstrong_Whitworth_AW.660_Argosy

I don't know if you already checked this source. It's not too bad about the AW 650/660.

Wizard

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2011, 05:35:54 PM »
Thank you for the Link. I've seen it before, and theres not nuch to read about the argosy as PAX carrier.

Seems it was very rare used this way...

Offline DHillMSP

  • Members
  • Posts: 1201
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2011, 03:47:33 AM »
Thank you for the Link. I've seen it before, and theres not nuch to read about the argosy as PAX carrier.

Seems it was very rare used this way...

Not in this scenario, apparently.  GGG is applying pressure on my routes by procuring these quickly off the assembly line.  And I think others are getting the same idea....  :P

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

  • Members
  • Posts: 4028
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2011, 09:24:43 AM »
It's my favorite prop aircraft in this early scenarios and I'm sad I've choosen another strategie this time. The AW 650 is great.

Wizard

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2011, 03:03:21 PM »
Not in this scenario, apparently.  GGG is applying pressure on my routes by procuring these quickly off the assembly line.  And I think others are getting the same idea....  :P

You mean people like me? ;) To sad, they dont deliver them bundled with new slots....

Offline DHillMSP

  • Members
  • Posts: 1201
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2011, 11:50:04 AM »
You mean people like me? ;) To sad, they dont deliver them bundled with new slots....

LOL  The joys of operating in the UK, eh?  ;D

Slots aren't the problem here.  What I don't get is, based on my analysis (yes, I'm one of those crazies with an über-sophisticated spreadsheet setup), he's burning through cash to get these planes to go up against me on previously uncontested routes and only getting an average of 20-40% load factor on them (I'm usually flying a CVLP or two on my short-haul stuff).  Are they really so economical as to permit profitability at that low of a load factor?

Wizard

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2011, 09:11:41 AM »
My spreadsheet results show CVLP and AW.650 nearly equal. Thay share a very good Gas / PaxMile ratio, like the NAMC. Electras seem overrated.

Offline DHillMSP

  • Members
  • Posts: 1201
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2011, 08:14:24 PM »
For me, it's a speed/range/PAX capacity question.  The Electras are faster and generally carry more - at this point, fuel burn isn't a major concern.  They're my main long-haul aircraft (until the 111-300 or -500 rolls out, anyways).

Wizard

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2011, 09:27:29 PM »
Did you compare the hi-ratd Electras to the Bad Boy TU-104b? I was surprised....

I created for myself 2 factors for judging:
- a thing i call 1-Year-TCO / seat , given by: LeasingRate+Maintenance (A,B,C) divided by seat capacity
- Gas / PaxMile

That applys only for a/c that can do the same job, naturely.
Harder is to calc out the Commonality costs, which are still in the dark for me. I didnt find out, how the next buy / lease will affect them, what is annoying...

Offline DHillMSP

  • Members
  • Posts: 1201
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2011, 12:16:47 AM »
Did you compare the hi-ratd Electras to the Bad Boy TU-104b? I was surprised....

I created for myself 2 factors for judging:
- a thing i call 1-Year-TCO / seat , given by: LeasingRate+Maintenance (A,B,C) divided by seat capacity
- Gas / PaxMile

That applys only for a/c that can do the same job, naturely.
Harder is to calc out the Commonality costs, which are still in the dark for me. I didnt find out, how the next buy / lease will affect them, what is annoying...

As a rule, I avoid the Tupolev line.  ;D

Commonality is a bit of a black box - mine dropped dramatically when I went from three to two types...now that I'm up to three again (swapping out the CVLP for the HP7), they went back up, naturally.  :o

GDK

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2011, 12:16:38 AM »
Why avoid Tupolev?
I'll order hundreds of Tu-114 if the production rate is fast. Carry nice amount of pax flying great distance and burn almost same fuel with jet. Speed is also not so bad and turn around is awesome.

Offline DHillMSP

  • Members
  • Posts: 1201
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2011, 02:09:15 PM »
Why avoid Tupolev?
I'll order hundreds of Tu-114 if the production rate is fast. Carry nice amount of pax flying great distance and burn almost same fuel with jet. Speed is also not so bad and turn around is awesome.

One word:  maintenance.  ;D

Offline Dasha

  • Members
  • Posts: 1001
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2011, 12:42:31 PM »
It's a nice aircraft depending on where you use it. Don't try to fully utilize it's range cause MY GOD is that thing slow... I fly one from Phoenix to Iowa +- 1000 nm and it takes 5 hours to get there and then another 6 hours to get back to Phoenix. In comparison, my Caravelle's with only 3 seats less does both legs in 3 hours. That is 5 hours per day lost because of the incredibally lazy plane. So in cheap fuel scenarios like this one, I'll be going for jets cause you can fit one whole more route into a schedule simply because of the speed.

Plus, let's be honest, the Argosy isn't exactly a looker...
The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes, decide everything

minerva

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2011, 03:10:50 PM »
Plus, let's be honest, the Argosy isn't exactly a looker...

+1

flightsimer

  • Former member
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2011, 04:10:07 PM »
Boac or maybe it was eastern midlands used them for passenger services. I believe it was used as a combi though. In James bond... He flys on one I. The movie but I can't remember which movie it was. I'm thinking golden member.

Offline TK1244

  • Members
  • Posts: 1245
Re: Armstrong Whitworth 650 - how was it used in real life?
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2011, 08:25:09 PM »
As a rule, I avoid the Tupolev line.  ;D
One word:  maintenance.  ;D
No problem with maintenance currently. They are my workhorses for medium haul flights ;D
TK Regional

 

WARNING! This website is not compatible with the old version of Internet Explorer you are using.

If you are using the latest version please turn OFF the compatibility mode.