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Author Topic: Tech stop at small airport  (Read 1211 times)

minerva

  • Former member
Tech stop at small airport
« on: October 12, 2011, 03:27:47 AM »
Can you do a tech stop at an airport too small to regularly handle your aircraft?  For example, a Very Large Aircraft at an airport that can only handle Large?

Offline Sanabas

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2011, 04:08:04 AM »
You could. I reported it as a bug, and apparently it was fixed, based on some posts in MT5.

However, I just tested it in JA, and successfully created a DC8 route via BHK, which is a size 2 airport, limited to large aircraft, but with a 3000m runway.

I still think if you can't fly a regular DC-8 route to it, you shouldn't be able to fly a tech-stop DC8 route through it. But that'd mean needing to remove the apparently blanket restriction on size 2 airports to never allow very large aircraft, even if they've got 6000m runways.

So yes, you can tech stop at any airport with a runway long enough.

minerva

  • Former member
Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2011, 01:53:14 PM »
Unfortunately, one of my competitors is doing exactly this (a B707 at a small airport with a decent runway), while I am using an appropriately sized tech stop base even though it adds several hundred NM to my route.  So I'm in an awkward position. I don't want to report a bug just because my competition is exploiting it, on the other hand I made a routing choice on the assumption that I should use a very large airport for tech stops for my DC8s (when they are delivered). 

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2011, 01:59:16 PM »
It's not exploiting. It was very normal big aircraft made techstops at smaller airports - take for example Gander or Iqaluit. They basically were build around the tech-stop airport, especially Iqaluit only got an airport to make it possible to cross the Atlantic.

Offline Sanabas

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2011, 03:28:31 PM »
It's not exploiting. But it's a reasonable assumption that an airport that explicitly disallows v.large planes wouldn't make a suitable tech stop for a v.large plane.

The problem is the blanket restriction for size 2 airports, places like Gander and Iqaluit shouldn't have that restriction.

If we're going to stick to blanket restrictions on operating v.large aircraft into size 2 airports, and no restrictions other than runway length for tech stops, I think that needs to be spelled out explicitly in the manual, or even on the airport page. Instead of saying:

Allowed aircraft types    Size class: Small aircraft, Medium aircraft, Large aircraft

It could say:

Allowed aircraft types    Size class: Small aircraft, Medium aircraft, Large aircraft - these restrictions do not apply to tech stops.



Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2011, 03:43:28 PM »
They are not allowed because of too small border control possibilities, terminals, etc. Not because of runway length or the disability to refuel the aircraft.

minerva

  • Former member
Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2011, 04:19:06 PM »
Thank you for the responses.  I think the suggestion by Sanabas regarding labeling of such airports would solve the problem in the future.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2011, 09:39:30 PM »
MAny of you forget that many of these runways were built FIRST as potential runways/bases for the inevitable nuclear war between the USA and the Soviet Union.

The SECOND reason is that they are often relief or runways used in case of emergency. 

As many have said, the infrastructure is just not there to turnaround heavies and possibly clear customs. 

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2011, 09:46:58 PM »
All you need to "turn around" them is a tanker. I'm sure that's a thing you'll find nearly everywhere...

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2011, 10:10:07 PM »
Okay Curse, while the tanker truck is great, I don't foresee it running up the road for some Jet A the next time an intercontinental jet is due to arrive.

You need the firefighting equipment
You need heavy runways, taxiways, stands...
In many cases, you'd need Cat 2 ILS systems
You need massive fuel operations (including receiving deliveries, storage and more)

I can go on but MANY of these things just don't exist at these fields.  These tiny airports are best served as GA only with some charter and light commercial flying only and not as potential places you could expect to be dropping in 707s for a top-off.  

Plus, shouldn't costs be extremely more, then?  If these services exist, they would need to be paid for.  There would have to be tons more staff at these fields sitting around waiting for the next jumbo to come up to the bar.  The lack of movements and the pax fees would really limit that airport's income.  It would simply have to be compensated for.

Few of those fields did exist. Tenerife is an example I can think of.  In this game that airport is considered to be much larger.  

In JA5, I am playing out of the infamously-short Sao Paolo.  I did it for the fun and the challenge.  It wouldn't be fun for me to fly a 707 200nm just to fill up and fly 3000nm somewhere else.   In real life that would have been modeled differently and I try to stick reasonably close to how things were done.  

minerva

  • Former member
Re: Tech stop at small airport
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2011, 11:22:47 PM »
Swiftus,

I agree with you, and I'm not forgetting or downplaying the original purpose or practical problems associated with such airports. Iqaluit is a good example (although it was still Frobisher Bay in the JA era). I've actually been there. Basic necessities cost three to four times what they do in the rest of Canada (and that was no different 50 year ago). Transporting to and storing fuel there costs a fortune.  The weather makes it a practically unusable airport in winter (that is, over six months of the year). Curse is certainly right that it was used for tech stops in the prop era, but as soon as airlines could, they dropped it as routing option, precisely because of its cost and associated weather delays.

Before Curse gets his knickers in a twist, I'm not suggesting that it or other such airports shouldn't be used for tech stops in AWS, only that real life aviation was and is far more complicated and dependent on more variables than is represented in AWS.



 

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