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Author Topic: Using browser extensions  (Read 5636 times)

Online Sami

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Using browser extensions
« on: July 24, 2011, 11:02:33 PM »

When checking the game error logs I have found out that a number of players have been using a software (or a browser extension actually) to access the aircraft market to reload the page more efficiently I presume.

Do understand that using anything other than a "human-controlled" web browser is not allowed. (ref. Terms of Service)

The used a/c page has a powerful additional logging installed and these are trackable. What they are doing is not just against the Terms but also unethical playing in my mind. And if the logs still indicate the usage of auto-refresh softwares or other non-allowed access the players involved may be penalized without warning from now on (including but not limited to closure of the game airline).


Also in the light of the logged data the used a/c refresh protection will be enhanced and it will soon start to deliver automated bans to whole game area (instead of just blocking the a/c page for some minutes) if constant and continuous refreshing is detected over a longer period of time.

« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 11:07:57 PM by sami »

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2011, 11:58:05 PM »
I wonder what information will be gathered through the night... there are ppl in Europe who should be asleep but are somehow online right now.  If they are refreshing at regular intervals, I hope the great ban hammer of justice falls from the sky. 

If you catch someone, I say kick from the game they are in.  Catch again and kick from aws.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2011, 12:00:59 AM by swiftus27 »

ucfknightryan

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2011, 12:04:00 AM »
I wonder what information will be gathered through the night... there are ppl in Europe who should be asleep but are somehow online right now.  If they are refreshing at regular intervals, I hope the great ban hammer of justice falls from the sky.

lol you just put an awesome image in my head.  Huge warcraft-ish hammer falling out of the sky like a looney tunes anvil to squash the hapless cheaters  :laugh:  preferably accompanied by the looney tunes anvil sound effect  :laugh:

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2011, 12:04:23 AM »
lol you just put an awesome image in my head.  Huge warcraft-ish hammer falling out of the sky like a looney tunes anvil to squash the hapless cheaters  :laugh:  preferably accompanied by the looney tunes anvil sound effect  :laugh:

ACME!

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2011, 12:09:16 AM »
I wonder what information will be gathered through the night... there are ppl in Europe who should be asleep but are somehow online right now.  If they are refreshing at regular intervals, I hope the great ban hammer of justice falls from the sky. 

If you catch someone, I say kick from the game they are in.  Catch again and kick from aws.

I guess refreshing while you are sleeping is not going to do much, since you can't act on the information gathered...  Unless you have a script sophisticated enough to lease an aircraft...

Online ekaneti

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2011, 12:57:32 AM »
I dont even understand what any of this discussion is about  ;D. How do you automatic refresh?

Offline Jona L.

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2011, 01:46:03 AM »
How do you automatic refresh?
Don't ask, don't expect an answer, then you won't get tempted ;)

Jona L.

Offline LemonButt

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2011, 02:21:16 AM »
When I need an aircraft, I use ChromeReload to auto-refresh the used aircraft page: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/njoipeaphfnaplplihpbgndfojhdhmjo

Based on this post, people using this or other browser extensions will be banned.  I am hoping that this is a temporary fix until a better long term solution is put in place.  With the current setup, the used aircraft market is always highly competitive and players do not resort to using these browser extensions because it's an easier way to get used aircraft, but because it's often the ONLY way to get used aircraft.  I would not call this unethical gameplay.  A system has been put in place with specific restraints and players have adapted their gameplay to maximize their return.

I used to play an online military game where you controlled infantry.  There was a bug where you could be outside of a building and click the corner of a building as you walked by on the outside and your infantry would walk through the wall.  The solution to this bug was that the updated versions simply didn't allow you to click in a corner, greatly reducing gameplay.  I believe the auto-refresh ban is of the same nature.  If the ban of auto-refresh extensions is a long term fix, it will greatly reduce the playability of the game.  I'm hoping this is just a temporary fix until a more sophisticated system is put in place.  I proposed a waiver system which allows every player a fair chance at every used aircraft on the market I sincerely hope is under consideration: http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,30100.0.html

Players using auto-refresh extensions isn't the problem--it's a symptom of the problem.  The problem is the current used aircraft market system being on a first-come, first-served basis where fractions of a second determine whether a player has access to aircraft or not.  Slot-hogging was merely a symptom of not having enough slots available and the system was revamped where slots were abundant and the slot-hogging disappeared overnight.  Why can't the same results be achieved by a revamp of the used aircraft system?

Offline FlyTO

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2011, 04:18:08 AM »
Or make the used market more friendly. It is true that getting a popular plane off the used market is near impossible and every second does count: especially when the reservation is about to reach 0mins and the next person can reserve the plane. It has happened to me twice where I kept clicking on the lease plane button hoping to reserve it, but the error pops up saying "excessive refresh of used market". This blocks the used market page for a couple minutes or someone else "snipes" it before.

Suggestion: Limit on total used planes each player can lease in the first 1-2 years. Once that limit has reached, those players can either start ordering new planes or buy planes from the used market.
OR the best way is to just have unlimited number of planes available so players can actually get the planes they actually want and when they want it with prices going up.

This will decrease the demand and the need to refresh the used market to be that one second ahead of your competitor to reserve an used plane. This is especially true in this game world as there are 600users and more than likely atleast 1/3 are online at the same time during the day in their respective time zones.

Guess the keyboard and mouse will have some more clicking to do for the time being :(
« Last Edit: July 25, 2011, 04:25:34 AM by kevin.yeung »

Offline ArcherII

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2011, 04:51:14 AM »
I think that all comes from the emptiness of airlines and all the demand in the world to be met at the start of the game world. Sure airlines will start to make money and cover more and more routes, thus needing more and more planes. That's unrealistic IMO.
Now, there was a feature under development. It was the implementation of AI airlines at the beggining of every world. This way, every player would need to run his/her airline with strong fundations and grow will be slower (as is with the new slot system). I guess that way the used market would end up being a nice and ocational option to the factory new market, and as are slots in 1.3, there would be plenty of good aicrafts in the used market everytime.

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2011, 06:55:47 AM »
I'm a bit unsettled.

Looking in the future with huge penalties "...(including but not limited to closure of the game airline)..." I don't know how often to reload the used market is allowed? Someone who has time an hour, watching a movie nearby on a second screen or whatever is absolutely able to create a similar reload pattern as some kind of reload extension.


If this is unethical gameplay or not could be discussed, however, it's your game sami and you make the rules, so I hope most people stick to what you said. Also it might be good if you point out (it's a bit since I read AWS TOS) what exactly is human-controlled. Out of my browsergame experience I'd say forbidden are scripts that work on their own, like scanning the market and also get aircraft or at least reserve them etc. That's no excuse for anything, simply the try to give you an impression what, maybe, others thought.


Online Sami

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2011, 09:05:24 AM »
Well, I sort of knew that some people will defend their way of action. However the points are:

- 'Reload protection' to used market was already installed in v.1.2. With the clear intention of removing the issue of players constantly reloading the page in order to gain advantage. You have been circumventing it by using an automation, but since the reload protector only looked at short term reloading it overlooked this automation if you had it set to something like 15sec intervals. But clearly the whole idea of constantly reloading the page is not allowed after the changes made already earlier.

- You are causing a huge and totally unnecessary strain to the servers. Which was another reason in the first place for this. I detected from the logs that you guys are reloading the page in worst cases every 10-15 seconds over a period of several hours. This accounts for thousands of completely unnecessary page loads and bandwidth used and this will be not allowed under any circumstances.

- Arguments about used market planes is not something that will be considered as the fact is that players using this are trying to take advantage by using AWS in a way it has not been intended, and it would probably either lead to more people to use the reloaders or some similar "race of player aids" that is even worse. With nobody being allowed to check the market too often there will be more planes to share.

- If you get the reload warning you cannot miss it. It's the only thing what you see on that page. It will block you from the used market page for several minutes. If the system detects that, even when the warning & temporary block has been given, the reloading continues the system will have the authority to ban the account completely for a temporary period of time. And this was already done for one account last night since even with the new & improved warnings given the reloading just kept going and going for more than 30 minutes (every time just getting the page block and warning), so clearly the user wasn't even on his computer! (well, no advantage can be gained then either, but completely ridiculous waste of resources; and I cannot of course tell if there would have been a script to automatically reserve the seen planes too?). So his account was banned for the night just to get a stop to that nonsense page loading. However in the future the ban will be at least 48 hours or more. But if there are several occasions of this on the same account the complete closure will be considered.

But the account ban is not something that you can get accidentially, be sure of that. If you see the big red warning and temporary page block then you know it's too much already.


(And for the long term solution, although this is one too, is that the game worlds will start running from 1950s and will end in 2020s/30s, so there is not really much of the initial rush one the rolling game world system gets going. However it's not final decision yet)

« Last Edit: July 25, 2011, 09:08:01 AM by sami »

Offline Wing Commander Chad Studdington

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2011, 09:47:06 AM »
I hate to say this but I agree with Curse. I hate the idea of people running scripts, I had had a suspicion that some were being run in this world.

I am worried, that like Curse says, it could be possible to fall foul of this unintentionally. I would wager that my name is one of the "auto-refreshers", not because I was using one but because last night I was bored, nothing was on TV (after Top Gear!) so for a while I had the used market open and was just hitting F5 when I looked at the page, not regularly or every 15 seconds but over the course of about an hour between Facebook and anything else I was doing I was hitting F5.

Eventually got a 757 out of it though!  ;)

Online bleedfax18

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2011, 10:08:50 AM »
@Dave: Did you get the warning? If not, then your fine, if I understood the post from Sami correct.
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Offline Wing Commander Chad Studdington

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2011, 10:16:28 AM »
@Dave: Did you get the warning? If not, then your fine, if I understood the post from Sami correct.

No, so I guess yes, I'm good.

Peanutoil

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2011, 10:24:16 AM »
- If you get the reload warning you cannot miss it. It's the only thing what you see on that page. It will block you from the used market page for several minutes. If the system detects that, even when the warning & temporary block has been given, the reloading continues the system will have the authority to ban the account completely for a temporary period of time. And this was already done for one account last night since even with the new & improved warnings given the reloading just kept going and going for more than 30 minutes (every time just getting the page block and warning), so clearly the user wasn't even on his computer! (well, no advantage can be gained then either, but completely ridiculous waste of resources; and I cannot of course tell if there would have been a script to automatically reserve the seen planes too?). So his account was banned for the night just to get a stop to that nonsense page loading. However in the future the ban will be at least 48 hours or more. But if there are several occasions of this on the same account the complete closure will be considered.

Well I'm the one who get banned just because i did not switch off the extension before sleep :D I'm sure i won't commit such "CRIME" anymore.

But it's not healthy for a webgame (or simulation) to have such first come first served based action. It's not our fault to create any advantage by using auto-reload extension. It's the man who design the game make such action advantageous. So if Sami don't want such "reloader" advantageous in your site, you have to review your gaming design instead of banning users.

By the way, I admit my fault. The ban is fair. :)

Offline Wing Commander Chad Studdington

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2011, 10:28:36 AM »
But it's not healthy for a webgame (or simulation) to have such first come first served based action. It's not our fault to create any advantage by using auto-reload extension. It's the man who design the game make such action advantageous. So if Sami don't want such "reloader" advantageous in your site, you have to review your gaming design instead of banning users.

Or you could just not cheat.

Online bleedfax18

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2011, 11:02:45 AM »
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cht7520

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2011, 11:15:52 AM »

Online [ATA] Sunbao

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Re: Using browser extensions
« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2011, 11:19:18 AM »
Well I'm the one who get banned just because i did not switch off the extension before sleep :D I'm sure i won't commit such "CRIME" anymore.

But it's not healthy for a webgame (or simulation) to have such first come first served based action. It's not our fault to create any advantage by using auto-reload extension. It's the man who design the game make such action advantageous. So if Sami don't want such "reloader" advantageous in your site, you have to review your gaming design instead of banning users.

By the way, I admit my fault. The ban is fair. :)


Or you could just stop cheating, and look at the used market when you have time just like the most of the other players.

 

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