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Author Topic: New Orders  (Read 2911 times)

Offline MidlandDeltic

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New Orders
« on: July 10, 2011, 06:06:34 PM »
I'm slightly frustrated.  My next 733 is due for delivery in March 1987.  However, there are many spare slots in 1986.  The problem is, if I try and order any further aircraft they are queued AFTER my exisitng order, depsite the number of slots available prior to that.  Is there any way I can overcome this, other than cancelling the exisitng order (and of course losing my deposit)?

MD

Offline ArcherII

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2011, 06:37:06 PM »
Did you ordered B733 before in this game world? If so, you'll get the next slot available for your airline, and not the next overall slot available.

Offline MidlandDeltic

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2011, 06:52:52 PM »
Did you ordered B733 before in this game world? If so, you'll get the next slot available for your airline, and not the next overall slot available.

Yes - sorry, I thought my use of the word next would have covered that.  I ordered a batch, and there was an 18 month gap between delivery dates for the last two of the batch.  I assumed that this was because there were no slots - but on checking prior to ordering antoher batch there are several empty production slots for 1986.  I thought the system was supposed to advance delivery if slots became available.

There are very few 733s on the used market - and the prices therefore are at ridiculous premiums (and the spec is not generally my preferred 3B2 engine / higher weight).  I am therefore stuck operating duplicated fleets for 2 years (at least) longer than necessary.  Just a bit frustrating when slots are available.

MD

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2011, 06:57:29 PM »
There are very few 733s on the used market - and the prices therefore are at ridiculous premiums (and the spec is not generally my preferred 3B2 engine / higher weight).  I am therefore stuck operating duplicated fleets for 2 years (at least) longer than necessary.  Just a bit frustrating when slots are available.

Ignore the cheap engines and the wrong MTOW.

Lease them!
Do it!
Do it!
Do it!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoqDYcCDOTg&feature=related

Seriously, 733 is not very good in flying to maximum range, so the cheap engines and standard MTOW is more than enough to operate 733 in a profitable way. And 160% isn't much if you think about the endless Billions you will earn with original King Airways 737-300!

Offline MidlandDeltic

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2011, 07:14:48 PM »
Last time I leased off you Curse, you stopped the re-lease option after 6 months.  Once bitten, twice shy...  Hence you got the 757 back early due A,B, and C checks :)

I have used 733s on long thin routes (eg Dublin - Halifax) with success before (in DotM1).  The 3B1 cannot reach that - and I prefer to have one standard fit so can shift aircraft around without worrying about range etc - another reason I want to get rid of my 732s (range between 1500 and 2100 nm).

Oh, and 160% is blatent profiteering - something we know about all to well here in Ireland


MD

Offline BobTheCactus

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2011, 07:25:27 PM »

Oh, and 160% is blatent profiteering - something we know about all to well here in Ireland


MD

Not really - returning aircraft just before heavy maintenance, ruining planes (like http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,31860.0.html), etc. costs so much that leasing out at market value is guaranteed to net a loss, and leasing out at 160% usually pays off a plane in 10-12 years (not including time spent sitting on the market), and that's before it begins to start paying off the net losses on other planes you leased out...

Quite simply, leasing in AWS does not make money at all, forget "blatant profiteering" - it's like extra bases, just something to do to keep you interested once you have maxed out your hub, generally costing you money...
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Offline MidlandDeltic

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2011, 07:35:29 PM »
Not really - returning aircraft just before heavy maintenance, ruining planes (like http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,31860.0.html), etc. costs so much that leasing out at market value is guaranteed to net a loss, and leasing out at 160% usually pays off a plane in 10-12 years (not including time spent sitting on the market), and that's before it begins to start paying off the net losses on other planes you leased out...

Quite simply, leasing in AWS does not make money at all, forget "blatant profiteering" - it's like extra bases, just something to do to keep you interested once you have maxed out your hub, generally costing you money...

I was talking about selling.  The only 733 on the market at the moment is at a ridiculous premium, for sale only.  In any event, I did make some cash in DotM1 leasing - the assets I leased were fully written down and ready for scrapping on return.

And the 757 I returned to Curse was due exams, but at 95% condition.  I just returned it (early) when the replacement aircraft arrived, prior to C-check as there was no way I was going to C-Check it for another two months use when I had expected, and intended to be able to renew the lease.  Treat leasees fairly, and they will treat you well in return.  Subsequently, I do not lease from any player unless I have absolutely no alternative.  Ditto buying at rip-off prices.

MD

MD

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2011, 07:53:54 PM »
Last time I leased off you Curse, you stopped the re-lease option after 6 months.

It's because of an AWS "bug". If I lease the aircraft out for one year, the renewed lease is 100% value and not anymore 160% as I want. That's why I cancel all lease renew possibilities.



Quote
Once bitten, twice shy...  Hence you got the 757 back early due A,B, and C checks :)

That's the problem of the guy who got the aircraft after you, not mine.


Quote
I have used 733s on long thin routes (eg Dublin - Halifax) with success before (in DotM1).

Success oftend ends when people notice the AWS statistics don't include overhead costs like staff, marketing and other things. The aircraft with it's pilots and crew might be posivite, but it's simply not designed to cover it's overhead costs on very long routes.


Quote
The 3B1 cannot reach that

Fuel consumption difference is too small to be important, especially with DotM fuel prices.


Quote
Oh, and 160% is blatent profiteering - something we know about all to well here in Ireland

It hasn't stopped you from leasing the 752 and the fact my aircraft are leased out very fast - some with very weird configs due to other nice customers or without C-Check or with 20% condition - show me that the way I do my business is not wrong.

Fortunately my airline has a good basement, something Ireland is missing. I think that's why my airline still is in a very good shape and the C-Check you haven't done brought me down :)



Offline MidlandDeltic

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Re: New Orders
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2011, 08:20:50 PM »
I leased a 752 as an experiment which worked.  I intended to extend, but the option was removed.  I therefore cancelled the lease so I wasn't paying for a C-Check for someone else (I care not who).  Good business I think you'll agree.  I leased a replacement 752 at short notice and high price to cover what has become a profitable route, and ordered a new one which will have a 33% lower lease cost when it is delivered later this year.  As I said, I will now only lease from players if I have no alternative.  The reason you can lease at those prices is that there is a shortage of aircraft (as ever), and the fact that slots for new aircraft production are not being filled (the original point of this thread), rather than your obviously excellent business acumen  ;)

On the 733 long routes, the example I gave showed a similar profit on a weekly basis without competition to the short haul ones subject to attack.  As I ran the game from start to finish without bankrupting undertaking two fleet renewals along the way, I assume was more than covering my costs. 

My issue with the 3B1 is range, not fuel (although the 3B2 is better, and gives a benefit if fuel goes up.)

MD

 

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