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Author Topic: Monopoly rule  (Read 2186 times)

Offline gustweit

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Monopoly rule
« on: June 08, 2011, 10:50:59 PM »
Why does it warn me about a violation with an automatic warning in a route I only want to fly ?

I see a lot of routes with only a company flying a lot of flights a day(monopoly)  . Was that company warn as well?

Offline NorgeFly

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2011, 11:02:23 PM »
Why does it warn me about a violation with an automatic warning in a route I only want to fly ?

I see a lot of routes with only a company flying a lot of flights a day(monopoly)  . Was that company warn as well?

which route?

Offline Sami

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2011, 07:45:40 AM »
http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Manual/General/Rules/#Competition


Quote
The airlines may not oversupply the estimated passenger demand on a route in large numbers. Airline may not supply over 200% of the estimated passenger demand on any route.

ksjoet

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2011, 12:12:39 PM »
sami: Is it intended that you only get that message if there is competition on the route?

Offline Sami

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2011, 12:57:11 PM »
No, the rules are completely irrelevant of other airlines. You may not break the rules even if there are no others flying.

sbond101

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2011, 01:16:34 PM »
The rule is designed to stop an airline running 230% capacity on a route in order to prevent new enterants from competing on the route.

ksjoet

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2011, 01:53:53 PM »
Then why don't the airline who operate on the Warsaw (EPWA) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) and Krakov (EPKK) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) get a message? On the Warsaw route he operates an T104 (84 seats) with 30-40 passengers/day demand and on the Krakov line an IL18 (85 seats) aircraft on a 20 passengers/day demand.

Offline TK1244

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2011, 02:51:27 PM »
Then why don't the airline who operate on the Warsaw (EPWA) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) and Krakov (EPKK) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) get a message? On the Warsaw route he operates an T104 (84 seats) with 30-40 passengers/day demand and on the Krakov line an IL18 (85 seats) aircraft on a 20 passengers/day demand.
Because an 84 seated aircraft supplies more than 200% of the capacity needed for the route for 30/40 pax/daily (210-280%). Same counts for the Il-18 flight. You supply 85 seats for 20 pax/daily, which is 425%, which is way more than allowed.

Quote
The airlines may not oversupply the estimated passenger demand on a route in large numbers. Airline may not supply over 200% of the estimated passenger demand on any route.
TK Regional

Ilyushin

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2011, 02:56:36 PM »
Then why don't the airline who operate on the Warsaw (EPWA) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) and Krakov (EPKK) - Moscow Sheremetyevo (UUEE) get a message? On the Warsaw route he operates an T104 (84 seats) with 30-40 passengers/day demand and on the Krakov line an IL18 (85 seats) aircraft on a 20 passengers/day demand.

My IL-18 flies that route only twice a week so I have 85 seats for 3 day.
To Warsaw I'm just on the edge of oversupplying/not over supplying. (84 seats, 40 demand)

ksjoet

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2011, 03:08:35 PM »
Because an 84 seated aircraft supplies more than 200% of the capacity needed for the route for 30/40 pax/daily (210-280%). Same counts for the Il-18 flight. You supply 85 seats for 20 pax/daily, which is 425%, which is way more than allowed.


Yeah, I know it's against the monopoly rule, just wondering why the airliner don't get an automated message by doing it.

The reason I'm bringing it up is because I've only seen the monopoly message once and that was on a route with competition. I was switching some prop routes over to my new BAC 1-11 and by accident I forgot to remove a prop aircraft that was flying a Saturday when it had time between the A check and regular routes. Supply for this route on a Saturday was around 130 with two aircraft while the demand was around 60. There were/is competition on the route and I quickly got a message about it telling me it would be closed within 48 hours. I noticed what was wrong and deleted the lone Saturday flight.

My IL-18 flies that route only twice a week so I have 85 seats for 3 day.
To Warsaw I'm just on the edge of oversupplying/not over supplying. (84 seats, 40 demand)
I got a message from just flying over 200% a single Saturday, so in that case you should be getting it on the IL-18 route to Krakov. These are low demand routes Illyushin and just wanna make clear I'm not after to "get you" out here in the public since I probably won't start flying on them anyway. Just wondering how the message system is working and/or it is intended to be like this.

Ilyushin

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2011, 03:18:08 PM »
I was actually quite surprised that I did not receive any message.

But if you really care, I'll switch the route to lower capacity for you.

Offline NorgeFly

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2011, 03:49:58 PM »
This has come up a few times recently... It's not covered in the rules but I do remember Sami altered it after the rule was put in place (but I cannot find the post in question).

As I understand it, you will not receive a warning message if the flight is once daily (or less), even if supplying more than 200%. This was disabled to allow players to serve very thin routes with aircraft that they already have in their fleet and may not be perfectly suited to the route.

But remember, as frequency is the crucial factor to winning market share - operating an 100 seat aircraft once per day on a route with demand of only 30 pax will not disadvantage another player operating a 30 seat aircraft on the same route with the same frequency. The effect will be the same if they operate a 30 seat aircraft, a 100 seat aircraft or a 200 seat aircraft (assuming that CI and RI are similar). This is why Sami disabled the warning message in these cases.

So, on a route with 30 pax per demand, you can have a single 100 seat flight but not two 50 seat flights.

I use F27's (48 seats) on a few very low demand routes (20 pax per day) and without any competition they are profitable. If someone else started the routes too, I doubt either of us would make any money at all so a bit of common sense needs to be applied.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2011, 03:52:06 PM by NorgeFly »

Ilyushin

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2011, 04:00:16 PM »
This has come up a few times recently... It's not covered in the rules but I do remember Sami altered it after the rule was put in place (but I cannot find the post in question).

As I understand it, you will not receive a warning message if the flight is once daily (or less), even if supplying more than 200%. This was disabled to allow players to serve very thin routes with aircraft that they already have in their fleet and may not be perfectly suited to the route.

But remember, as frequency is the crucial factor to winning market share - operating an 100 seat aircraft once per day on a route with demand of only 30 pax will not disadvantage another player operating a 30 seat aircraft on the same route with the same frequency. The effect will be the same if they operate a 30 seat aircraft, a 100 seat aircraft or a 200 seat aircraft (assuming that CI and RI are similar). This is why Sami disabled the warning message in these cases.

So, on a route with 30 pax per demand, you can have a single 100 seat flight but not two 50 seat flights.

I use F27's (48 seats) on a few very low demand routes (20 pax per day) and without any competition they are profitable. If someone else started the routes too, I doubt either of us would make any money at all so a bit of common sense needs to be applied.

Only now I dare to admit I have quite some of such routes. :-[

I barely have any routes left to put my IL-18Ds on...

ksjoet

  • Former member
Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2011, 04:10:54 PM »
Thank for clearing it up NorgeFly, didnt know about that one :)

Offline NorgeFly

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Re: Monopoly rule
« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2011, 05:01:37 PM »
Thank for clearing it up NorgeFly, didnt know about that one :)

I've been trying to find the forum post where Sami mentioned this but cannot find it... perhaps Sami could clarify this officially for us?

 

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