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Author Topic: The modern times no longer new  (Read 1833 times)

Nlgravity

  • Former member
The modern times no longer new
« on: April 21, 2011, 05:48:51 AM »
Is it just me or are the game worlds (TMT being the perfect example) getting a bit too repetitive?

There is a problem when you know exactly which routes make money before digging into the the route planning. It seems that every game world has the same trend.... Same airline in top 5, based in same airports, with the same fleet.

I love AWS and cannot come up with an alternative. But I have bankrupted 3 very successfull airlines in the past just for the hell of it; to start from the beginning and enjoy the first game year.

Maybe game worlds should not have a pre determined calendar end date. It makes the game world end sooner than the actual end date since people dont want to start if by the time they get big enough, there would be only 100 players.

I though of the following:
1- A game world that ends when the largest airline reaches X market value. And could potentialy be a very long game world. The airlines trailing behind the leader, would try to weaken and squeeze the leader to keep the game world running.

2- Issuing equity. Selling shares of your airline to AI venture capital much like you sell your aircraft to Eagle Aircraft Group. And If a player does an IPO, the other airlines can buy shares with their cash.

3- Used and new aircraft silent auctions bith by AI dealers and players themselves. I believe this is a great idea. Because it will create flow of high demand aircrafts not by being the lucky one online, but by bidding for it. That way, you'll think twice about getting that shinny A380 and people would be more engaged in the business aspect.

4- Aggressive swings in pax demand due to made up events. Imagine you have 10 flights per day with 90%+ LF. But something happens (war, olympics, etc) and now your route demand changes. LF from 90% to 10%. Now you have to be aware and not just leave the game on autopilot. Strategy would come back into play.

Sorry if these points were already discusse numerous occasions. But I feel like AWS is such a great engine and template that could be exploited in a better way with a bit of creativity.

Seeing the same guys on top all the time with the same strategy makes the game a bit too repetitive. 

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2011, 08:09:18 PM »
The main reason most of the games are nearly the same (ATB, MT3, MT4) is because the game world starts as a mirror copy of what large airlines have done in real world, and it is set in stone.  Delta's hub in Atlanta is the reason why it is the busiest airport.

AWS game world is static, tied to decisions of big airines.  The airports and their slots are static.  The decisions made by players in AWS do not make any difference on the game world.

Suppose the biggest airline that controls 80 to 90% of traffic in Atlanta shuts down, and there are virtually no flights in and out of Atlanta.  In real world, people would find new connections to get to their destinations.  The traffic of all the other airlines,  and all other hubs would skyrocket in that scenario.  Not in AWS.  All the connecting traffic tied to Atlanta will forever be tied to Atlanta.

1.3 will not do a whole lot.  But if Sami gets the "City based demand" and passenger connectivity off the ground, every game will be new and unique.  Hubs will be where successful AWS airlines make them.  Passengers will connect dynamically, based on availability of flights...

Hopefully, Sami can wrap up 1.3 ASAP so that he can shift focus to this new makeover of AWS.

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2011, 10:00:52 PM »
JumboShrimp - that's a great answer and very good points you made.

And just for the record, Im not putting down the great effort that is made behind the scenes. I love this web site!

Offline BobTheCactus

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2011, 01:18:08 AM »
JumboShrimp is absolutely right.

That said, I agree completely with 1 and 4

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Offline swiftus27

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2011, 11:34:07 AM »
I actually brought up world events back in the day and was basically shut down. 

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2011, 07:52:48 PM »
I dont know about everyone else, but I happily pay twice or more the price of credits to play AWS if the engine is updated with the complexity of making game play less predictable.

I pay $200 per month on s***ty Verizon Fios I only use to watch soccer games.... I happily give that to Sami intead ;D

Offline Pilot Oatmeal

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2011, 07:55:48 PM »
+1 id definitely pay twice more for city based demand

filipebravo

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2011, 11:54:15 PM »
I'd pay double credits to see an auction system implemented for the used market where you can only bid once and you can't see bids placed by other airlines.

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2011, 12:35:23 PM »
+100000 I would pay more also......When is 1.3 its been a month we haven't heard anything... :'(

Offline Sami

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2011, 02:04:57 PM »
I've been tied with one other project for the last two months so AWS has been on background. But that is now in final stages (finally) and aws work will continue after that.

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2011, 07:16:02 PM »
I've been tied with one other project for the last two months so AWS has been on background. But that is now in final stages (finally) and aws work will continue after that.

So when are we expecting it?

1 weeks

2-3 weeks

1 month?

wapp11

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2011, 07:47:45 PM »

4- Aggressive swings in pax demand due to made up events. Imagine you have 10 flights per day with 90%+ LF. But something happens (war, olympics, etc) and now your route demand changes. LF from 90% to 10%. Now you have to be aware and not just leave the game on autopilot. Strategy would come back into play.


Like a tornado hitting St. Louis Lambert like last night? I wonder how much traffic Mid-America St. Louis can handle... it has a 10,000ft runway!

flightsimer

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2011, 03:54:24 AM »
Being Somewhat new, i have yet to had an airline get past 15 aircraft after coming into worlds that were already in progress.

My Base airport, Pittsburgh always has a lower passenger %. In fact in MT4, Cleveland has a higher passenger % than pit which is a little reasonable for the late MT4 times, but in DOTM and the early years of the MT it should be high. All CLE practically gets is Continental Rj's now.

Pit used to be USAir's largest hub that had over 500 daily departures. Its was in the top 20 busiest airports until USair pulled out completely. Hell, it had daily 767, A330 and 747 service to Europe in its glory days of a hub and two years ago Delta began service to Paris all based off of domestic demand, yet in AWS there is zero demand to any of the largest European cities. The delta flights are going to daily if not 9 weekly flights this summer and there is talk about them being switched from 757's to 767's...

I dont like the idea of the auctions though. It would cause the little airlines to have to fight with the majors that already control the game. Its hard enough to get aircraft when you first start. I had to wait 2 days to get an aircraft to use when i first started in MT4 and that was nearly a month into the game.

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2011, 01:09:04 AM »
I dont like the idea of the auctions though. It would cause the little airlines to have to fight with the majors that already control the game. Its hard enough to get aircraft when you first start. I had to wait 2 days to get an aircraft to use when i first started in MT4 and that was nearly a month into the game.

Somewhat true. Small airlines will defenitely be at a disadvantage. But larger airlines will pay more money for their fleet. This will lower the profit margins of the "high bidding airlines" which will in turn lower the growth rate of larger carriers. This is like taxing the rich more than the poor.... even things out a bit.

This brings me to another point..... how about making a "tax bracket" for corporate profits based on total revenue? THis will only work if applied as an "alternative minimum tax (AMT)" model. For instance, if you make >X in total revenues, then you have to pay a higher percentage in taxes so if you bought a lot of planes to make income negative, you will get a smaller tax refund from uncle Sami  ;D

Why would this be attractive? Because it allows smaller carriers to have higher capital expenditure than larger carriers (as a % of revenue of course). This would even things out a bit.

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2011, 07:14:22 AM »
This brings me to another point..... how about making a "tax bracket" for corporate profits based on total revenue? THis will only work if applied as an "alternative minimum tax (AMT)" model. For instance, if you make >X in total revenues, then you have to pay a higher percentage in taxes so if you bought a lot of planes to make income negative, you will get a smaller tax refund from uncle Sami  ;D

I think you are spending more time thinking how to bring others down than figuring how to build a successful airline on your won.

Nlgravity

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2011, 03:34:42 AM »
I think you are spending more time thinking how to bring others down than figuring how to build a successful airline on your won.

+1  ;D

wapp11

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #16 on: April 29, 2011, 12:53:29 AM »

This brings me to another point..... how about making a "tax bracket" for corporate profits based on total revenue? THis will only work if applied as an "alternative minimum tax (AMT)" model. For instance, if you make >X in total revenues, then you have to pay a higher percentage in taxes so if you bought a lot of planes to make income negative, you will get a smaller tax refund from uncle Sami  ;D


I'm a huge fair or flat tax advocate... and I'm loving the flat tax in this game! Just if the rest of the people in the US would get on board!

L1011fan

  • Former member
Re: The modern times no longer new
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2011, 07:06:14 PM »
No bidding, no auctions, thank you.

 

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