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Author Topic: Ticket Prices??  (Read 4371 times)

Offline iFlysimX

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Ticket Prices??
« on: February 17, 2011, 03:17:46 AM »
When I fly from KFLL to KATL = 505NM the ticket prices are $147 Y Class

When I fly from KFLL to KORD =1023NM the ticket prices are $153 Y Class

Now why only $6 Difference when the route is 2X longer?? Should KORD be $300???

Thanks!!

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 03:21:34 AM »
did you look at the type of plane your flying?

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 03:24:17 AM »
Same type A320-200.....I increased the KORD prices by 25%......hope it doesnt effect the LF

Offline BobTheCactus

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2011, 03:25:12 AM »
Suggestion: fly shorter routes

And increasing prices over default will result in a significantly lower LF, so undo it.

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Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2011, 03:27:24 AM »
Suggestion: fly shorter routes

And increasing prices over default will result in a significantly lower LF, so undo it.



thats a **BIG** bug in the game........As I increased the prices my LF went flying down big time......Sami is there a solution to this because its not realistic at all.....and not fair.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 03:31:04 AM by Clement »

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2011, 04:06:04 AM »
It is fair the way he has it set up for example your route from fll to ord is 153 a person,

If you look at expedia now the cheapest fare is 197 with one stop . Now although this price is higher the game is set in 1996 so if you take in inflation and other factors that would be the same price you have right now. Don't blame the system. Also if you are trying to save money adding that 757 to your fleet is not the way to go   

Offline Sigma

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2011, 04:18:27 AM »
And now you know why everyone says to fly the short routes first.

There is no "realism" with distance and price in real-life.  It's hardly a linear relationship where a route being twice as far would be twice the price, or anything even remotely close to that.

For example, right now:

SWA from LAX-LAS $104 (about $0.50/mile)
SWA from LAX-DEN $79 (about $0.08/mile)
SWA from LAX-DAL $109 (about $0.11/mile)
SWA from LAX-LGA $149 (about $0.07/mile)

So for the price of flying to Vegas, just some 200 miles, you can fly to Dallas which is about 5 times as far away.  Or Denver, which is 3 times further away than Vegas, is 30% cheaper to fly to.

Generally speaking, as someone who buys 2-4 tickets a week, most airfares range within a fairly limited area whether one is flying 200 miles or 3000 miles (I don't pay less than $200 or more than $500 too terribly often, regardless of how far I'm going); and it is quite common, if not actually most likely, that shorter flights actually cost more than longer ones.  Airfares are all over the map in terms of the relationship between distance and price.  There's so many other factors involved including, the least of which, competition and total demand (i.e. economies of scale).  Sami had to settle on something, and it's one that doesn't factor range in in a considerable manner.  

Route pricing in AWS seems to group routes, so that short routes are all very similar in pricing, and medium-haul routes, say somewhere between 500 and north of 1000 miles doesn't change price much, but as routes get near and exceed 2000 miles they tend to go up a lot more.  This actually matches reality fairly closely in my experience and opinion.

In AWS (in JA3):

SWA from LAX-LAS $50 (about $0.40/mile)
SWA from LAX-DEN $60 (about $0.07/mile)
SWA from LAX-DAL $60 (about $0.06/mile)
SWA from LAX-LGA $110 (about $0.05/mile)

As you can see, really not all that different than what we see in reality per the SWA fares above.  In fact, factor in what about 20 years of inflation (since those prices are out of JA3), and the pricing would be pretty damned close to the same.  In fact, a hell of a lot closer than I was expecting them to be when I checked them.

Quote
thats a **BIG** bug in the game........As I increased the prices my LF went flying down big time..
As well it should.

It's not a "bug".  Most people tend to think of the demand in AWS as being very inelastic for some reason -- that these people are sitting in line at the airport waiting to fly whoever is there at whatever price.  But that is absolutely not the way it works here.  The demand chart is the number of people who would fly if you meet their demand criteria, of which price is a big one (but, oddly enough, a low price isn't).  As soon as you raise the price an appreciable amount over the default, they just decide not to go or they drive or whatever.  You drop that demand chart down in a big way because you're not worth it to them anymore.  

To do otherwise would bring significant economic issues to the game.  Margins are already insanely ludicrous as it is.  If people could set pricing any appreciable amount over default they'd increase exponentially.  In real-life there's competition and regulations that prevent such things.  Here there's rarely competition and certainly no regulation -- so the game has to come down hard on those increasing pricing measurably over standard.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 04:42:56 AM by Sigma »

Offline pascaly

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2011, 04:25:28 AM »
Nice reply sigma.

Claiming that something is 'not fair' is hardly a call to arms for Sami to jump up and fix something.  Once you understand the situation, you see that it is in fact quite fair.

Here in Australia, it can be cheaper to fly to Bali or Thailand than it is to fly to one of the other capital cities, and that includes taxes and 'surcharges'.  Never forget, it's cheaper per seat to fly a 767 than it is a CRJ (bad example maybe....everything is cheaper than a CRJ!)


Offline Sami

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2011, 12:56:15 PM »
thats a **BIG** bug in the game........As I increased the prices my LF went flying down big time.....

No, it isn't.....


(for the record, ticket price vs. distance effect is coded to AWS too as one of the main components, but the raise is not exponential and there is no set tariff for a mile; it works different way)

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2011, 01:06:49 PM »
Sigma,

As i check on Expedia it is more then double the price to fly to KORD then to KATL nonstop.....

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2011, 02:23:08 PM »
Did you forget the us airways fare on there.
And also the fact that the game is base in 1996 right now and were in 2011?
I think you are expecting to much out of this game. While it is the best airline sim I've played I will be first to admit that the games has some minor bugs. However you do not see me
Complaining about the game. Just learn how to play the game
The best you can.

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2011, 02:31:19 PM »
Did you forget the us airways fare on there.
And also the fact that the game is base in 1996 right now and were in 2011?
I think you are expecting to much out of this game. While it is the best airline sim I've played I will be first to admit that the games has some minor bugs. However you do not see me
Complaining about the game. Just learn how to play the game
The best you can.

I also think this is the best Airline Sim and i am not complaining, I was just wondering if it was normal as it doesnt look normal to me.

Offline Sigma

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2011, 02:41:47 PM »
Sigma,

As i check on Expedia it is more then double the price to fly to KORD then to KATL nonstop.....

And?

Did you not read what I posted, complete with examples?

It's got nothing (or very little) to do with distance.  It has to do with market forces at work, namely the competition on the route for one.  So you found a particular route where the further route costs more.  So?  For every pair of routes you find where the further route costs more you can easily find a pair where the further route costs less or find routes that are the exact same distance but one costs 2 or 3 times more to fly.  Ultimately, airlines don't price based on distance, they price based on what the market will allow.

Don't tell me you seriously expect AWS to reflect the real-world pricing of every single route-pair in existence? 

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2011, 02:54:17 PM »
And?

Did you not read what I posted, complete with examples?

It's got nothing (or very little) to do with distance.  It has to do with market forces at work, namely the competition on the route for one.  So you found a particular route where the further route costs more.  So?  For every pair of routes you find where the further route costs more you can easily find a pair where the further route costs less or find routes that are the exact same distance but one costs 2 or 3 times more to fly.  Ultimately, airlines don't price based on distance, they price based on what the market will allow.

Don't tell me you seriously expect AWS to reflect the real-world pricing of every single route-pair in existence? 

First of all you need to calm down ok. I was just asking a question and I don't know how AWS is coded and how it calculates the prices.

Offline Sigma

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2011, 02:58:44 PM »
First of all you need to calm down ok.

Ironic, coming from a guy using fifteen question marks, screaming about ****BIG**** bugs needing to fixed right away, "unrealistic" ticket pricing (despite evidence to the contrary), and complaining about how the game isn't being "fair".

Offline iFlysimX

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2011, 03:11:36 PM »
Ironic, coming from a guy using fifteen question marks, screaming about ****BIG**** bugs needing to fixed right away, "unrealistic" ticket pricing (despite evidence to the contrary), and complaining about how the game isn't being "fair".

Im sorry that i dont know how the pricing works.......and it was only 4 * and it did look like a bug. How about having a little patience if your going to answer question  ;)

Offline Pilot Oatmeal

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2011, 06:11:21 PM »
I see where clement is coming from, the farther the distance, more fuel needed, ticket price rises... however there are more things to take into consideration...landing fees, staff fees,etc.....

Although i think clement is just frustrated since im owning him in KFLL ;) haha JK mate :D

Offline Pilot Oatmeal

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2011, 08:07:05 PM »
I must say having alook at real world flights ..... ATL is MUCH CHEAPER.... and even with inflation the way the prices work it shouldn't have made KORD much cheaper than ATL...

I think this is a very valid point

Offline RushmoreAir

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Re: Ticket Prices??
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2011, 08:48:42 PM »
I must say having alook at real world flights ..... ATL is MUCH CHEAPER.... and even with inflation the way the prices work it shouldn't have made KORD much cheaper than ATL...

I think this is a very valid point

Your regression analysis was done poorly

This is a bad example because ORD is notorious for no LCCs.  Include Midway in your search, and I bet you will find prices very similar.  Plus, FLL is a mini-hub for AirTran and ATL is their main base, so you can expect prices to be much lower between the two cities.

You'll find that price has nothing, repeat NOTHING to do with distance both IRL and AWS


Sami should not code in these discrepancies, as 1) They should improve in 1.3 with city-based demand and 2) They are the exception to the rule.

Just my two cents . . .



PS

If you offer someone a penny for their thoughts, and they give you their two cents, where did the extra change come from?  ;D

 

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