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Author Topic: Fluid Cabin Crew  (Read 1560 times)

hjp766

  • Former member
Fluid Cabin Crew
« on: September 16, 2010, 01:13:17 PM »
Couldn't find this before so apologies if a repeat:

Would it be possible (and I appreciate probably not) to have the choice as to whether we min crew or not and at the same time have the min cabin crew not hard coded but dependant on seat numbers.

This would mean that if you wanted to fly above min crew you could get better pax service and rep, but also, if you wanted to fly min crew to save costs (a la easyJet, Ryanair etc) you could.

It should be a direct function of seats fitted not the current arbitrary number.

e.g. for the UK the regulations can be found in CAP 393 (the ANO) section 5 and read (paragraph 48/49):

Quote
Required cabin crew of aircraft
48 (1) This article applies to each public transport flight by an aircraft registered in the United
Kingdom which has a maximum approved passenger seating configuration of more
than 19 and on which at least one passenger is carried.
(2) The crew of the aircraft on each such flight must include cabin crew.
(3) Subject to paragraph (4), on each such flight there must be carried not less than one
member of the cabin crew for every 50 or fraction of 50 passenger seats installed in
the aircraft.
(4) The number of members of the cabin crew calculated in accordance with paragraph
(3) need not be carried if:
(a) the CAA has granted permission to the operator to carry a lesser number on that
flight;
(b) the operator carries the number specified in that permission; and
(c) the operator complies with any conditions subject to which the permission is
granted.
Power to direct additional crew to be carried
49 (1) Subject to paragraph (2), the CAA may, in the interests of safety, direct the operator
of any aircraft registered in the United Kingdom that all or any aircraft operated by him,
when flying in circumstances specified in the direction, must carry, in addition to the
crew required to be carried by this Part, such additional persons as members of the
flight crew or the cabin crew as it may specify in the direction.
(2) The CAA may not issue such a direction to an EU-OPS operator.

Therefore, if you upgrade the seats to be more comfortable (which reduces capacity) there should then be the option to reduce the number of cabin crew you carry.

Perhaps an option under aircraft to say whether (by fleet type) you want to carry min crew, min crew +1 etc.

HJ

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2010, 01:44:18 PM »
^^^ been talked about.

You can't forget that there must be a minimum cabin crew for the number of emergency exits as well.

hjp766

  • Former member
Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2010, 04:08:09 PM »
You can't forget that there must be a minimum cabin crew for the number of emergency exits as well.

I know. My day job sees me at the pointy end of a "Trois cent vingt" or "vingt et un". ;D

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2010, 04:25:28 PM »
I know. My day job sees me at the pointy end of a "Trois cent vingt" or "vingt et un". ;D

????  320?  21???

I speak some french and dont get it.

hjp766

  • Former member
Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2010, 05:19:58 PM »
????  320?  21???

I speak some french and dont get it.

Oh but you did... currently stuck with FMS1 crossed with GPS version... I want my FMS2 back  :'(
« Last Edit: September 16, 2010, 05:22:34 PM by hjp766 »

Offline Minto Typhoon

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2011, 07:22:21 AM »

I'd like to bump this proposal.

However, I'd switch it around - the higher the F and J class seat count the higher the crewing requirement.

It should be - One CC for every 50 seats
Plus One CC for every 15 J class seats
Plus One cc for every 5 C class seats.  (CX have 2 crew for 9 seats)

Offline ukatlantic

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2011, 07:08:32 PM »
????  320?  21???

I speak some french and dont get it.

He's a pilot on the A320/321  ;D

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2011, 11:07:31 PM »
I didn't want to do a re-post of something that was suggested but its not really a suggestion as more it's some what wrong?

For instance the 727-100 on in JA4 has 114 seat normal configuration. But it requires 4 cabin crew. This is more a matter of what the airlines wants.

Per FAR 121.391
A airplane having more then 19 seats but less then 51 seats requires only one flight attendant. If more then 50 but less then 101 two flight attendants are required.
The flight attendant must be located close to the floor level exits for all phase of flights.

So technically you could have 3 flight attendants and be legal to fly the aircraft.

Basically you need one flight attendant for every 50 seats on your aircraft. Now delta and others tend to put more on bored to preform first class duties and such.
So i would like to see to where the cabin crew requirements are changed to what there suppose to be. I mean why should we have to pay for the extra FA when we
don't need them?

Offline JumboShrimp

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 11:25:06 PM »
Yeah, it seems that it should be based on configuration completely, not really on the aircraft.

Offline alexgv1

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2011, 04:51:56 PM »
One thing I never got was going from the 150 seat MD80 to the 150 seat MD90 you went from needing 3 cabin crew to 4.
CEO of South Where Airlines (SWA|WH)

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2011, 08:55:25 PM »
Cabin crew has been discussed ad nauseum.   The reason for more cabin crew has to deal with number of factors.  In case of md80 to 90, im pretty sure it has to do with the number of emergency exits

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2011, 11:57:34 PM »
it has nothing to do with the exits. It's based on the number of seats you have on the plane.
757-2 has roughly 200 on a normal configuration on delta it has 2 fwd doors 2 mid doors and 2 rear and 4 overwings for a total of 10 exits.
Now on delta if its just going ATL-MCO it'll have 4 FA because you have 200 seats. It all depends on what the airline wants. FAR's state
you need 1 FA for every people not per exits. You have to have the FA stationed at every the floor level exit. so i mean i don't see why
we have to pay extra for cabin crews when we don't need them. The only reason you see delta and others with so many cabin crew is they do to first class service
and such as that. For us on here though i do not see the reason for more cabin crew.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2011, 01:28:19 AM »
Usually but not always. Number of exits may cause a higher requirement than the 1/50 rule, one CA per door pair at least... (though off the top of my head can't think of a plane that is affected .. but for example you couldn't fly A321 with 100 seats and 2 Ca's. It will need at least three I believe.. but normally 4 of course as it has so many seats)

Offline Blur CEO

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2011, 01:58:04 AM »
Federal Aviation Regulation 121.391
A airplane having more then 19 seats but less then 51 seats requires only one flight attendant. If more then 50 but less then 101 two flight attendants are required.
The flight attendant must be located close to the floor level exits for all phase of flights.

Im pulling this from my FAA Manuel

You can have a A320 with two FA if you had 100 seats because you have one at both sets of floor levels.


It's the number of seats not doors. Im just asking for it to be looked into.

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2011, 12:18:49 PM »
Ugh, dont make me get my FAR/AIM.  I don't want to read it.

Offline alexgv1

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2011, 12:21:30 PM »
It's the number of seats not doors. Im just asking for it to be looked into.

Yes but I think the EU regs are different, i.e. to do with doors; and I think they were the ones taken into account of the programming.
CEO of South Where Airlines (SWA|WH)

flightsimer

  • Former member
Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2011, 11:41:54 PM »
^^^ been talked about.

You can't forget that there must be a minimum cabin crew for the number of emergency exits as well.
Only for the JAA which doesnt rule the world. The FAA only requires one per 50 installed seats. Im not sure about Japan's (cant think of their letters)

Offline Sami

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Re: Fluid Cabin Crew
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2013, 06:08:04 PM »

 

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