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Author Topic: Impossible to compete against huge airlines  (Read 2513 times)

Offline Mnemic

  • Members
  • Posts: 43
Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« on: June 23, 2010, 01:49:55 AM »
I started my airline in 2003 and serveral years after the first airlines started.

Been trying to work my way up to a nice income, but it is really hard finding slots free in any airport existing in game, even if there is still a huge demand.
Recently a new airport opened (well actually less than 10 minutes ago) and I bought my first base in this airport. 5 minutes later I see the new changes of the aiport slots:


In less than 1 day of operating then most hours are already fully taken, by 1 company.
I have made a huge order for my company (10 planes), which won't have anything to do when they arrive, since all is gone and there is nothing I can do about it.

This airline is dominating Japan, with more than 400 planes. He is occupying most (if not all) slots of the main aiports in Japan.
I don't mind competition, but this is impossible, no slots = no growth = no income = nothing to do = Waste of money for joining a game where you can't compete fairly against already settled airlines.

I hope there will come a solution to such things, else in the end 10-20 airlines can dominate the globe alone with the new hub system and no limit on slots per airline. And with 500+ airlines in my game then it gets complicated.


Anyone with me, or should I just bite the dust?  ???
« Last Edit: June 23, 2010, 01:58:16 AM by Mnemic »

GDK

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2010, 02:18:26 AM »
I'm with you. But, this is a game. What to do....
Another issue here:
http://www.airwaysim.com/forum/index.php/topic,22539.0.html

losgatitospeligrosos

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2010, 02:25:52 AM »
There are several cities (at least) in America I've looked at with 2 or more 500+ pax routes wide open. You can build a nice base there and then getting a bigger 2nd hub after making money off the first. Or you can throw yourself into the meat grinder that is established huge airports. Your decision  ;)

Offline psw231

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  • Posts: 295
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2010, 02:58:14 AM »
 It wasn't a new airport that just opened, it was an upgrade from a previous airport and all airlines from the previos airport move to the upgrade.

Filippo

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2010, 07:11:15 AM »
The problem for you small airlines is that you all go and choose hubs where a very big and dominant airline is already based, or likely to in the future. It is therefore obvious, since he would like to have the largest amount of pax for himself, that he will try and take you out.

As losgatitospeligrosos said, there are plenty of good and empty US airports with good amounts of demand free. choose one of those airports, as you're not going to win in larger ones

Offline Maarten Otto

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Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2010, 08:44:13 AM »
Remember that there is NO WINNER in this game. You win by setting your own goals and try to achieve them. My goal in the game is to own ALL planes flying for the company. And I have 15 years from now to do that.

If I succeed by doing that... I declare myself to be a winner.

GDK

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2010, 11:54:10 AM »
Remember that there is NO WINNER in this game. You win by setting your own goals and try to achieve them. My goal in the game is to own ALL planes flying for the company. And I have 15 years from now to do that.

If I succeed by doing that... I declare myself to be a winner.

You got the point! +1

Offline CKHo

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  • Posts: 56
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2010, 01:35:25 PM »
Hi,

FYI, my base was moved from RJNA to RJGG automatically since RJNA (Old Nagoya) have been closed. The move was made one day after the new airport opened therefore such an dramatical increase in the slots within several minutes.

Regards
Ho

-------------------------------------------------

Message from Civil Aviation Administration,

Your old base airport has closed and your airline operations have been moved to the new airport opened near your old base.

All aircraft and other equipment have been moved to the new airport and all your routes have been automatically updated - operations resume normally after one day.

Your new base is: Nagoya - Chūbu Centrair (RJGG - NGO)

Offline Mnemic

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  • Posts: 43
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2010, 05:23:09 PM »
I found out about the change of airport, I mistook it for being a new airport, which explains better that huge traffic from day 1.

Anyway as mentioned above, then my choice of main base was a good choice serveral routes with a couple of thousands of people a day. But the trouble some part is the slots which basicly makes it impossible for my airline to grow much more.

About the goal of the game, I think everyone knew that. But some people have goals like archiving a huge airline or taking down competitors. As of now, those goals will not be possible to archive, even if you try your best. 0 slot or very few makes it impossible to add new routes where there still is a huge demand, just no slots free in the airports.

Anyway I hope for a fix to secure your airline slots enough to be established in an airport.

And to ho fly airline, nothing against you just used your airline as an example since it is one of the biggest in the game and that we're established in the same places.  :P

Talentz

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2010, 07:52:17 PM »
Remember that there is NO WINNER in this game.


Ehh... I guess my version of winning is a liiiiittle bit different then everyone else.   > : )




Talentz

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2010, 08:55:08 PM »
The problem for you small airlines is that you all go and choose hubs where a very big and dominant airline is already based, or likely to in the future. It is therefore obvious, since he would like to have the largest amount of pax for himself, that he will try and take you out.

As losgatitospeligrosos said, there are plenty of good and empty US airports with good amounts of demand free. choose one of those airports, as you're not going to win in larger ones

I agree with Filippo.

I run a regional airline. I am doing very well with Saab 2000 and E-170 aircrafts.

But, to start the airline, i chose a small airport, with almost no competition, which could support me.

Then when i got a solid basis, i went to a big airport.. Not big, a medium one, but i can face competition and get good results.

You must begin in a medium airport with low competition. Then, when you get strong enough, you move to a bigger airport.

You can't fight them while you are small.. But when you grow up, you can! So, grow first, fight after.

Remember that using small aircraft like the S2000 and the Dash 8, you can beat almost any route flying 737 / A320 family... And most of the bigger airlines use those planes, so be smart and get them by their feet ;)

Offline FlyingFast

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Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2010, 08:57:18 PM »
Well - I donīt think thereīs no chance to "win" against bigger competitors. I used to manage such a "big" airline in Buenos Aires, made
some mistakes - had to be off from this lovely game for a while, because of may job...and BUMMMM - I had to restart.

I choosed overcrowded Frankfurt with a big competitor, find some unflown routes and right now - Iīm doeing pretty well. And the
airline starting nearly the same time with me, is doeing also pretty well ;)

so try - try - try, search good routes to start with - and have fun.

many greetings out of germany
(still beeing lucky to reach the next round in soccer  :D )

flydreamer

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2010, 12:51:28 PM »
then, if we can't really 'win' and beat 'big' airlines, why don't you create 'smaller' airline like regional airline.

i used to make 'big' airline but didn't succeed pretty well, and then i tried something new for me, a regional airline, and i make a big profit weekly, well, at least big for me since i have never make such profit before.  :laugh:

but every player has his/her own goal, and the goal for me is to create a healthy profitable airline like i do now  :)

Hwoarang

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2010, 04:54:31 PM »
then, if we can't really 'win' and beat 'big' airlines, why don't you create 'smaller' airline like regional airline.

i used to make 'big' airline but didn't succeed pretty well, and then i tried something new for me, a regional airline, and i make a big profit weekly, well, at least big for me since i have never make such profit before.  :laugh:

but every player has his/her own goal, and the goal for me is to create a healthy profitable airline like i do now  :)
Yup, that's right, I don't need 100+ aircraft and an airline based at a major airport. A healthy profitable airline is good enough for me ;) Trying out new airports now

L1011fan

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2010, 06:21:12 PM »
The problem for you small airlines is that you all go and choose hubs where a very big and dominant airline is already based, or likely to in the future. It is therefore obvious, since he would like to have the largest amount of pax for himself, that he will try and take you out.

As losgatitospeligrosos said, there are plenty of good and empty US airports with good amounts of demand free. choose one of those airports, as you're not going to win in larger ones
Not neccessarily. I have quietly slipped in, under the radar at huge airports, and no one notices until I start to show some establishment. This is really possible too. Just don't announce yourself on the forum! I never give out what routes I fly or am about to, what planes I am going to buy until I actually do it. So its completely possible to "sneak in" if you can get a hold of a couple of decent slots and good city pairs. Just keep it to yourself. Thats all. ;D

Yukis

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2010, 09:52:22 AM »
i guess the impossible that he said include that any player who start an airline in this time period can't even found a place to fly to due to the lack of airport slot . . .   :'(

I'm just start my airline again today in ATB  at Bucharest - Henri Coanda in europe . but i can't find any place to fly to due to the airport around me don't have any slot left at all some of airport that have slot is a night flight time which no pax want to travel a short houl intl flight at night . So i'm waste my 5credit with ATB again without anything to do . hrrrrrh

maybe Sami should gave player a chance to search and airport first before deduct a player credit Just to gave them nochance to leave .

Feel like i'm so stupid myself waste my own money for nothing  :'(

flydreamer

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2010, 10:15:25 AM »
you searched the airport in the wrong area. you will find plenty of unoccupied 'not-bad' airports across asia, and unless you look in busy airports like beijing, tokyo-narita, hong kong, or singapore, there will be plenty of airports, with plenty of slots left, that you can fly to ;)

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2010, 06:09:13 PM »
Asia.. smaller airports in Europe too! Try France, Italy, UK.. you probably will fing a good airport with low competition and good demand ;)

US has lots.. LOTS of medium airports, its a good market too!

stevehindy

  • Former member
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2010, 11:55:41 AM »
I ve only been playing this for just over a week...through trail and error and some advice from a good friend, along with going bust twice, I have now set my self up with three aircraft and a little hub. I agree you cant compete with the big guns but at the end of the day its only a game. Even being a small airline I get a lot of enjoyment just trying to run an airline and make a profit. There are routes out there to be had ..just takes time and a lot of searching and thinking.....keep at it !!!

Offline Maarten Otto

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    • My photo site
Re: Impossible to compete against huge airlines
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2010, 04:04:53 PM »
Hi, I run a decent airline, and it took me four years to fight my way into Gatwick.

1- Opened at a reasonable airport with good domestic and short haul demand.
2- Opened a new hub at a class 4 airport which was not served, Ordered 25 planes for it.
3- Opened a new hub at a Larger airport with good domestic demand again and ordered something like 30 AVRO jets for it.
4- After four years and some experience in long haul... I finally returned to my base country for the fourth and last hub, Gatwick.

So... it takes a long time... but it can be done if you stick to your goals.

 

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