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Author Topic: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?  (Read 3831 times)

ual777

  • Former member
Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« on: June 05, 2010, 11:22:33 PM »
Anyone having any luck running longer haul (3+ hrs) RJ flights? I have tried running the flights with high density and regular seating and after the lease payments kick in they start turning in losses. Anyone having the same problem or solved it?

Thanks

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2010, 11:37:28 PM »
Well.. i guess RJ should fly as many flights as possible.. So, routes on less than 400nm.. or 500nm.. so they can fly 4 or 5 times a day ;)

The ideal is flying like 6 times a day, with a ~200nm route

ual777

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2010, 11:43:04 PM »
I was trying to take advantage of the RJ's range to make some more profit and with a base in CMN there is not an abundance of 100+pax routes.

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2010, 11:52:40 PM »
That's why you should analyse the demand before ordering the aircraft heheheh..


Maybe you can convert it into busniess seats and create a only business service to somewhere if you have the demand.. try to London... LHR

ual777

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2010, 12:01:23 AM »
LHR is full. Just trying to understand why the planes are not profitable when used within their ranges as other aircraft are. Specifically EMB-145LR. The planes are running on routes with sufficient demand.

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2010, 12:09:49 AM »
lets say a 200nm route..

Flying with the ERJ-145, you can fly this route 5 times a day (i am guessing.. don't know for sure)..

And the ticket price is.. lets say.. 120 USD

And now you have a 500nm route.. You'll be able to fly only 2 times a day, probably.. With a ticket price of.. lets say, 140 USD or less..

So, which do you get more money? heheh..

And if you have a 1200nm route, you can fly only once a day.. the ticket price will be like 200 USD, but you don't get enough PAX.. With a 120 seats aircraft you have almost the same costs (assuming similar fuel burn) but 120 pax paying.. and the ERJ, only 50 pax paying..

flydreamer

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2010, 01:36:26 AM »
i didn't get pretty well too when i operated ERJ-145LRs out of Spokane, WA and finally, i went bankrupt because the cost of operating is just killing me. they say Saab 2000s will do well on regional routes, and it does. now i have 4 of them and i started to make money.

but the range of Saab 2000 is just ~800nm, so i don't have much route option to be opened, and therefore, i need planes with 50 seats or so but with more range, and unfortunately the plane option is not pretty well too. so, any of you can successfully run regional airline with profitable jets? if so, what jet?

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2010, 02:34:37 AM »
As i said before, dude!

You cannot have a good profit flying a 50 seats plane in a medium range route!!

If you have a 50 pax or less.. even 75 or 80 seats, you must try to fly as more routes as possible... If you have a 100 PAX route, but within 2000nm range, you shouldn't ever fly that route.. because probably you are not going to have a good profit flying this route.. You will profit, but the profit wont be enough..

Make the calculations..

You have 5 routes within the range of 400nm daily.. and each route gives you like 12 000 USD / week
You have two 1200nm route daily.. and each route gives you like 20 000 USD

5 x 12 = 60 000 USD / week with this plane
2 x 20 = 40 000 USD / week with the same plane

flydreamer

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2010, 03:24:43 AM »
then i think we can't really make a regional airline then, since aircrafts with more than 100 seats aren't really considered as regional carriers. ??? because what matters is the amount of pax we carried, is it not? the more pax we carry then more profit we can get.

CX717

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2010, 03:57:24 AM »
Because in reality regional or commuter route are not intend to make profit,but to feed the main hub to hub route.
we actually make more money than the real airlines,our top airlines profit margin go as high as 40%,while the best airlines in reality like SQ,the profit margin just about 8%.


munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2010, 04:16:31 AM »
then i think we can't really make a regional airline then, since aircrafts with more than 100 seats aren't really considered as regional carriers. ??? because what matters is the amount of pax we carried, is it not? the more pax we carry then more profit we can get.

Yes, you can!
If you are based in a small country with many airports... Or islands.. For example, Philipines.. I had a very profitable airline in Philipines flying AVRO jets (85 seats) and DHC-8's (53 seats)

In europe also, you have lots of airports in a good range.

flydreamer

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2010, 07:41:18 AM »
unfortunately now i based in Xiamen, China which is a very large country and the demand of short-haul high-density flight is not so much.  :-\ but i think i'll give it a try to run some log-haul flight for my Saabs and see what will happen...

GDK

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2010, 02:33:00 PM »
Anyone having any luck running longer haul (3+ hrs) RJ flights? I have tried running the flights with high density and regular seating and after the lease payments kick in they start turning in losses. Anyone having the same problem or solved it?

Thanks

Passenger don't like high density seat on flights over 2 hours. sami said that somewhere before

ksliu9

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2010, 06:20:30 AM »
Anyone having any luck running longer haul (3+ hrs) RJ flights? I have tried running the flights with high density and regular seating and after the lease payments kick in they start turning in losses. Anyone having the same problem or solved it?

Thanks

I have more 30 RJ (most of them are RJ100), and 80% of them have 120 seats config. They are making lots of profits to me!!! But note that as I've made 120 seats, the range is reduced to 950nm only. So the max flying hour is just around 3 hr. Then it's fine with high density econ seats! 

That's the formula to make profit with RJ. Personally I think RJ is excellent for those airports with lots of demand within 1000nm (such as China, my base is in CAN and SZX). The best thing is, you don't need to wait (when compare to similar B717, B737-xxx....)!!!  But if you fly RJ70 or RJ85 to those airports around 1000-1400nm, then they can't make profit to you, coz if you fly that range, you need to use RJ70 or 85 (or 100 with less seats). Less than 100 seats for that range cannot make any profit! If you have 1 to 2 those routes, it's still fine, just regard as to make fun. But if you rely heavily on those routes, definitely cannot survive.

Offline apenfold

  • Members
  • Posts: 295
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2010, 09:06:09 AM »
You want to try making a short haul airline profitable then take a look at Highland Airways.

http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Info/Others/Airline1188

Its a bit of a step down from my last airline but I have managed to make it profitable within the UK operating 29 seat aircraft and 3 Saabs. Following the business model of Eastern Airways (real), frequency is the key to services as well as increasing prices to default as soon as possible after opening a route. Having the multiple flights a day also makes it harder for the competition to get in on routes. Overall I get my aircraft flying 4 or 5 flights per day, with one on 3FPD and one on 6FPD and they are profitable. If you want to try running a commuter airline exclusively then give this business model a go, because I've made several attempts and this is the first that has been successful.

Offline Maarten Otto

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Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2010, 02:48:16 PM »
Done this a couple of times as well, and to be honest I think it's the most interesting form of playing this game. But in return, it is the hard way.

Offline apenfold

  • Members
  • Posts: 295
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2010, 03:01:58 PM »
Absolutely. I was running InternationalCity Airlines in ROTMA and I got bored of it eventually because I was so big and so dominant there was nothing more I could really do. This is defiantly the most interesting form of playing the game because it is hard and you have to make decisions - that would be tiny to a larger airline - that could lead to bankruptcy. Its tough but I find it more rewarding.

munipandita

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2010, 09:39:29 PM »
I am running Catita Express from Belfast City Geroge Best, in UK, with Saab 2000's... And they are just great.

I have 5 of them, and i was making 500 000 USD per week... Only fice 58 seats saabs!  :P

But i forgot to schedule their maintenance (again..  :-[) and they are like 64% condition.. I am repairing them, but one at once.. But my CI went to 0.. =/

Lets wait..

MattDell

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2010, 08:14:10 AM »
You want to try making a short haul airline profitable then take a look at Highland Airways.

http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Info/Others/Airline1188

Its a bit of a step down from my last airline but I have managed to make it profitable within the UK operating 29 seat aircraft and 3 Saabs. Following the business model of Eastern Airways (real), frequency is the key to services as well as increasing prices to default as soon as possible after opening a route. Having the multiple flights a day also makes it harder for the competition to get in on routes. Overall I get my aircraft flying 4 or 5 flights per day, with one on 3FPD and one on 6FPD and they are profitable. If you want to try running a commuter airline exclusively then give this business model a go, because I've made several attempts and this is the first that has been successful.

Not to toot my own horn, but here's another good example: http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Info/Others/Airline425

The key is short flights, high frequency.  I don't make much money off of flights over 350nm.  In fact, the best routes are the ones in the 50-100nm range.  I also don't recommend more than one aircraft type (sorry, apenfold).  They key is finding a good aircraft with low maintenance costs and easy on fuel.  Going for a turboprop will save you A LOT on fuel!

-Matt

ReedME

  • Former member
Re: Any Luck with Long Haul RJ Flights?
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2010, 10:30:38 AM »
The ERJ145LR never makes money on long range but I have discovered my new fleet of ERJ135LR's make a lot more on the same routes, probably because their costs are lower ?

 

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