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Author Topic: PARAGON...more realism please!!!  (Read 4135 times)

se.basti.an

  • Former member
PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« on: May 04, 2010, 05:41:59 PM »
Yet again these unrealistic some flights ... This is annoying and makes no fun!

competition YES ... unrealism NO

Dubai - Hong Kong
   
-----6-    PGN150    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
------7    PGN160    2235    1050*    DC10    Parago n Airlines    
1------    PGN172    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
-2-----    PGN184    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
--3----    PGN196    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
----5--    PGN208    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
---4---    PGN220    2235    1050*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
------7    PGN038    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
1------    PGN052    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
-2-----    PGN066    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
--3----    PGN080    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
---4---    PGN094    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
----5--    PGN108    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
-----6-    PGN122    2245    1100*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
12345-7    PGN352    2250    1100*    A333    Paragon Airlines    
1------    PGN026    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
-2-----    PGN040    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
--3----    PGN054    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
---4---    PGN068    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
----5--    PGN082    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
-----6-    PGN096    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines    
------7    PGN110    2255    1110*    DC10    Paragon Airlines

Offline Brockster

  • Members
  • Posts: 1889
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2010, 05:46:04 PM »
Hmmm... if you have a look at the other airlines,  flying the route it's worse than my schedule... Sooo... Nice try.  ;)


12345-7    ASE1022    0905    1315    B743   Aero Asie   
123-567    ASE1030    0905    1315    B743   Aero Asie    * from 02-Sep-98
123456-    ASE1014    0910    1320    B743   Aero Asie   
12345--    DAA022    0915    1330    DC10   DANTES AIR   
12345--    DAA034    0915    1330    DC10   DANTES AIR   
12345--    DAA036    0915    1330    DC10   DANTES AIR   
-234567    ASE1018    0915    1325    B743   Aero Asie   
12-4567    ASE1034    0915    1325    B743   Aero Asie    * from 02-Sep-98
1-34567    ASE1038    0915    1325    B743   Aero Asie

Sure, I can and most likely will improve the schedule on that route in the future but not right now. :)

Offline LemonButt

  • Members
  • Posts: 1895
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2010, 10:27:53 PM »
I'm obviously missing something here...why is this is a problem?

Offline highways1

  • Members
  • Posts: 145
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2010, 11:45:58 PM »
Apparently he's never heard of red-eyes.

ICEcoldair881

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2010, 02:13:42 AM »
Apparently he's never heard of red-eyes.

lol I was thinking the same thing! :laugh: dude, I think that red-eyes are stupid, but deal with it. ;) and how is it annoying?!? not to mention, you said yourself that it was not unrealism. if it isn't, than what's the problem?!?

Offline CVACEO

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  • Posts: 601
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2010, 03:50:28 AM »
The flights shown for Paragon are not "red eyes" - they are overnight flights that make perfect sense.  You may not like the fact that he sets up a unique flight number for each day but, if he is sharing that route amongst several aircraft throughout the week, that is the only way you can do it within the current parameters of AWS.

Why would you think red eyes are stupid?  They are perfectly legitimate even if they are less profitable compared to daylight flight times.

Offline Sigma

  • Members
  • Posts: 1920
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2010, 05:27:48 AM »
The thing Sebastian finds "unrealistic", despite the fact that countless examples of such activity happens in real-life, is not the time of day that the flights are, but rather that Paragon has 4 flights departing for the same location within a 20-minute timespan.

ucfknightryan

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2010, 05:34:46 AM »
The thing Sebastian finds "unrealistic", despite the fact that countless examples of such activity happens in real-life, is not the time of day that the flights are, but rather that Paragon has 4 flights departing for the same location within a 20-minute timespan.

You just beat me to posting that Sigma.  Yeah, I don't see the big deal, in a slot limited airport, flights go where flights can go.  Sometimes it's going to result in weirdness...

wtdawg

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2010, 06:07:58 AM »
The thing Sebastian finds "unrealistic", despite the fact that countless examples of such activity happens in real-life, is not the time of day that the flights are, but rather that Paragon has 4 flights departing for the same location within a 20-minute timespan.

Um.  I lived in Atlanta - world's busiest airport - for a decade.  You would NEVER see that many flights from Delta to the same overseas destination leaving at virtually the same time.  So, I too find it ridiculous, despite "countless" examples which I've never seen.

Offline Sigma

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  • Posts: 1920
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2010, 06:38:44 AM »
Um.  I lived in Atlanta - world's busiest airport - for a decade.  You would NEVER see that many flights from Delta to the same overseas destination leaving at virtually the same time.  So, I too find it ridiculous, despite "countless" examples which I've never seen.

You actually lived in the airport? Wow.  ;)  While I can't say I've actually lived in one, there are many weeks that I literally spend more time in them than I do my own home -- I have earned over 2 million miles on American (all Domestic -- perm Platinum), 1 million on United (perm Premier Executive), and have little trouble earning my A-List w/ Companion on Southwest the past few years that they've been my favorite (used to hate them many moons ago).  I would say that I spend more time looking at A/D screens in US airports in a given week (for those locations I fly to that actually have screens) just watching the flights come and go than most people spend watching TV.

Atlanta doesn't have massive international demand (in comparison to its' domestic percentage), so it's no surprise you wouldn't see overseas destinations with departures that close.  But I can 100% guarantee you that you'd see somewhat similar schedules for more domestic destinations out of ATL.  Atlanta has numerous destinations that it originates over 100 flights per day for -- you aren't flying that many flights without bumping them really close together, at some points of the day within 5 to 10 minutes of one another.

It's also common for carriers to fly planes to seemingly unusual destinations very, very late at night, often with flights very close to one another, for the purposes of repositioning aircraft and/or clearing out the major hubs.  It's common, for example, in many Midwestern smaller airports for most of the outbound flights to be very early in the morning and most of the inbound flights to be very late at night -- simply because the airlines use them to park their planes at overnight.  As a result you end up seeing several flights to ORD, DFW, ATL, all the major hubs all pressed very close to one another between 6am and 7am; and likewise many departures from those hubs late at night, sometimes very close to one another.  Perhaps not every 15 minutes, but FAR closer together than the demand on that route would necessitate at 10pm at night.  Omaha, for example, departs twenty-five flights in the morning before it ever sees a single arrival.  Every single one of those planes was left sitting on the tarmac overnight, and most all of them are going to just a handful of major airports, including no less than 3 flights to Denver within 10 minutes of one another before the sun even comes up.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2010, 06:43:15 AM by Sigma »

ICEcoldair881

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2010, 11:30:09 AM »
Sigma you sound like you're that guy in "Up in the Air" ;D funny enough I live (and have always lived) no more than 10 minutes from Toronto Pearson so I use a radio scanner and I constantly hear (I monitor the clearance delivery as it is the coolest 8)) flights by the same airline (aka Air Canada) flying to Montreal, Ottwawa, Calgray, Winterpeg and Vancouver, all within a 30-minute period. I think that what Brockster did would be acceptable. ;)

Offline LoonyToony

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  • Posts: 388
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2010, 11:52:55 AM »
It's called optimizing your schedule. A lot of planes cannot fly routes every day at the same times, if you plan them day by day like Paragon does, you can fit at least six flights a week in stead of one every other day.

I don't see the problem as it's only three daily (or nightly if you so wish) flights. You should see my schedule from Washington Dulles to LHR. You're in for a suprise then..

wtdawg

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2010, 11:02:33 PM »
It's not that the airline has many planes leaving at the same time... it's the same route.  If the original poster was correct, it's 4 planes leaving at virtually the same time on the same long-haul route.

No matter how you try to argue that, that simply does not happen in real life.

Ever.  

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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  • Posts: 4028
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2010, 11:08:01 PM »
No matter how you try to argue that, that simply does not happen in real life.

Ever.  

Then it must be very nice that AWS is a game. Puh. Lucky Brockster...

ICEcoldair881

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2010, 11:11:50 PM »
No matter how you try to argue that, that simply does not happen in real life.

Ever.

yes it does. all the time. If there are slots, the airline will use them to fly to their hub. simple as that. NUMEROUS airlines do that in RL, like Porter, WestJet and Air Canada for Canada, and I know that Ryanair and EasyJet do some routes like that. ;)

ICEcold

Offline Sigma

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  • Posts: 1920
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2010, 12:21:29 AM »
It's not that the airline has many planes leaving at the same time... it's the same route.  If the original poster was correct, it's 4 planes leaving at virtually the same time on the same long-haul route.

No matter how you try to argue that, that simply does not happen in real life.

Ever.  

Whether it's "Long-Haul" or "International", qualifiers you keep mentioning, has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

Two factors come into play both in real-life and in AWS:

1>  Route Density.  Regardless of how far the plane's going or where it's going, the number of passengers who want to fly it determines how many flights, at a minimum, there needs to be.  If the density is such that a plane must leave for that destination every 5-10 minutes of which there are hundreds of examples in reality then it's got to happen.  The fact that it does happen is one of the reasons why the 747/A380 exists -- to limit the number of departures there needs to be to a single destination.

2>  Plane Positioning.  If all your planes are arriving at your major hubs at 8-10pm, they've now all got to leave.  And generally go to airports of a bit lesser density (so they don't face the same parking problem they have at your hub).  This means that there are countless examples in real life of planes flying at very close departure times to the same destination late at night even if the route doesn't necessitate it simply to get the planes to where they need to be in the morning.

Offline JonnyAngel

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  • Posts: 179
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2010, 05:22:51 AM »
NUMEROUS airlines do that in RL, like Porter,

Point of clarification, as a former Porter employee - they don't stack their flights that tightly. Minimum bunching is 40 mins during the morning and evening 'rush hours' (maybe 30 mins on YUL and I'd have to check that. We used to do a wonky 1230 departure...). They're good but I don't think even the Deluce's could keep that many planes turning on route that quickly and we'd  ;D

In ANY scenario - if Paragon can do it, then why the heck not? I mean is he oversupplying? - no Is he just squatting on slots? - no Is he using his planes efficiently? - yes Hell, I wish I could build that kind of scheduling efficiency.

Offline CUR$E - God of AirwaySim

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  • Posts: 4028
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2010, 06:11:08 AM »
Until we can say the pilots to not fly full speed, until pax like landing at 4:55am as well as 5:00am, there will be a lot of starts to the same destinations between 8pm and 11pm.

ICEcoldair881

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2010, 10:56:43 PM »
Point of clarification, as a former Porter employee - they don't stack their flights that tightly.

YOU WERE A FORMER PORTER EMPLOYEE?!?!  :o :o :o man, you're god right now in my books. ;D

Tobseren

  • Former member
Re: PARAGON...more realism please!!!
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2010, 12:17:43 PM »
I think in IRL, BMI British Midland used their ERJ-145's on the Edinburgh - Copenhagen - Edinburgh route with 2 departures, 5 minutes from each other... It sounds wierd, but if it can function, it is okay ;)

 

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