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Author Topic: Regional Airlines in Jet Age  (Read 2552 times)

auerbacs

  • Former member
Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« on: February 12, 2010, 05:02:17 PM »
Does anybody have an idea how feasible small aircraft are in this game? I know that marketing and staffing tend to screw up this strategy, but I decided to give it a go anyway. I'm based in NZCH and I decided to buy an Aérospatiale N262, which only has 29 capacity (I know that that's not exactly an advisable strategy if one is going for world domination). It's quite efficient, it's listed as a small aircraft so staffing is quite cheap, and it will have all of its routes to itself. So it's the best case scenario from that perspective. Still can a 29 capacity plane make any real money? With the credit I can secure from owning the aircraft, I'm hoping to soon order a second.

Hay anybody tried a similar strategy? Any idea how it might work out for me?

Thanks,
Auerbacs

Offline psw231

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2010, 05:15:19 PM »
 i started with a simmilar strategy in B5, but did mix my fleet a bit with a couple of 752's early on. as i used mosly DHC-7's and 8's which are small but twice your size it may not be the same but what i did was pick an area with many routes to smaller airports under 400 nm and link each to a larger center a A-B-C-B-A  and was able to control all of these routes 100% and take 90%+ of the major centers %, no competition seems to be the key and expansion to more med ac as your cash permits, now dominating Canada

Offline lastchancer

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2010, 09:45:42 PM »
Maybe a problem is the limited range (310NM) of the N262. You might run out of route options soon.
For exemple, you can not reach Auckland (400NM) non stop.
Maybe F27´s (http://www.airwaysim.com/game/Aircraft/New/View/6/) would be the next step.

Once, I tried to start a regional carrier with brand new 40-seaters, but I failed because the low LF´s at the beginning (lowCI and RI) diddn´t make the money to cover the high leasing cost even though flying up to 5 routes per day and no competitiors.
Your in advantage, you own your N262, but it may take a loooong time, before it earns the money to BUY a 2nd N262.

In this game world, I´m based in Anchorage/Alaska. I´m doing short haul routes with Convair 240.
They are a little bit old, but easy to get: plenty of them on the used market for good prices. So you get more planes for your little starting money and can expand faster. My C 240 are all profitable, although they need 3 pilots and 2 cabin crew.
Surely I have to replace them in some years, maybe with new leased (or even bought ???) F27´s.

F27 and C240 are medium aircraft, not sure how much that increase the overall costs compared to small aircraft like the N262.

Soo, good luck down under!
Greetings from up north!
 
 


« Last Edit: February 12, 2010, 09:49:07 PM by lastchancer »

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2010, 01:02:35 AM »
I've ordered 12 brandnew (leased) Fokker F27Mk200s and will try to start a regional airlines in Izmir (ADB), Turkey. I'll let you know about my experiences. The first a/c will be delivered 14 August 1965.
TK Regional

auerbacs

  • Former member
Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2010, 04:25:22 PM »
Yeah lastchancer, you're right about the range issue. That said, there's a pretty serious competitor in Auckland whom I don't want to provoke, so limiting my range makes that a non factor. I think that competitor may have even over-expanded, so I'm hoping that he bankrupts and I can move up to Auckland and transition from regional airline to international, keeping the N262s and adding some larger aircraft. The advantage of owning just N262s is that I'm practically immune to bankruptcy. They're so efficient and cheap to run that I can't see getting into problems, even if my competitor made a concerted effort to destroy me, which would be a waste of his time. Given that my issues in this game have always been due to overexpansion, I like the idea of playing it slow. That said, I couldn't help myself and ordered a new leased N262, giving me 2.

The fokkers are definitely a nice play. I think I picked the N262 only because I could afford to buy it from the start. I may look at them later, but I'll probably just try to use the credit leverage of owning the 262 to eventually lease a 737 or something similar and take on the transtasman routes. The C240's are an attractive option, because you can expand much faster, but with the 3 pilots, 2 cabin crew and significant maintenance costs, they make you vulnerable to more efficient competitors. Of course, people might just leave Anchorage for you anyway, if you're lucky!

Good luck up North.

And do let us know how that strategy works out for you TK1244. Whatever happens, you'll have a pretty-looking route map!

Auerbacs

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2010, 07:19:37 PM »
And do let us know how that strategy works out for you TK1244. Whatever happens, you'll have a pretty-looking route map!
Yes I'll let you know about my experience with the Fokker propliners. Last weeks profit was -22 569 USD with just one F27 operating and no route image. I think I will make money soon when the RI goes up.
I first wanted to use a second hub, but couldn't find anything within Turkey, so for now it will be only operating from Izmir. Many routes are being added every x hours. ;)
I can see the F27 is very popular at this moment (122 orders, right after 727-100 with 241 orders and BAC 1-11 200 with 141 orders), I just ordered another F27, but it will be delivered in February next year :(
« Last Edit: February 13, 2010, 07:22:01 PM by TK1244 »
TK Regional

Offline Maarten Otto

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2010, 10:25:57 AM »
Yes it can be done... I run a regional airliner in France in DOTM using Embrear 120's (30 pax). It is difficult, and you MUST fly almost 24/7 in the beginning. I now have almost 50 of the 30 pax planes and the company is making a decent profit. Don't expect wonders to happen.... but to test your managing skills its perfect.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2010, 10:29:21 AM by Maarten Otto »

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2010, 09:33:21 AM »
With Friendship number 12 delivered, I'm making profit again. The profit isn't very much at the moment, but I'll see it growing within some months.
CI: 55.46, lowest RI: 4, highest RI: 46, profit last week: 56 887 USD, LF: between 27.1 and 57.8 %.
The profit is with standard ticket prices, I'll reduce the tickets this week to see what the effects are.
TK Regional

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2010, 05:25:51 PM »
Dont overlook the NAMC

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2010, 10:15:01 PM »
Dont overlook the NAMC
NAMC can carry more passengers than the Fokker F27-200, but has +/- 320NM less range. Fuel burn is almost the same.
TK Regional

auerbacs

  • Former member
Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2010, 03:12:41 AM »
shh... everybody should overlook the NAMC so that I don't have to wait for it when I want to buy it...

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2010, 05:37:59 PM »
shh... everybody should overlook the NAMC so that I don't have to wait for it when I want to buy it...
I prefer Dutch over Japanese, so I'll definitely overlook the plane :laugh:
TK Regional

Offline swiftus27

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2010, 06:08:31 PM »
NAMC can carry more passengers than the Fokker F27-200, but has +/- 320NM less range. Fuel burn is almost the same.

do yourself a favor and change the number of PAX on the NAMC...  

I opted for 48 Y standard seats plus 3 C standard    .... its range jumps to 1240nm     ... With that its range is better, its seating is better, its speed is better...    Both are the same class size and have same turn around.

NAMC > FOKKER F.27   but not necessairly the Fokker 50
« Last Edit: February 16, 2010, 06:13:53 PM by swiftus27 »

auerbacs

  • Former member
Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2010, 06:11:33 PM »
that's good advice, i can fly that config across the tasman...

Offline kamila-gr

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2010, 08:22:06 PM »
Im using the F27 as well to cover the greek islands, seems to be working pretty well, also doing the A-B-C-B-A routing.
I am making a decent amount of profit with the aircraft despite my competition and around 50% LF. Ive got 12 of them at the moment with another 3 on the way.

auerbacs

  • Former member
Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2010, 04:07:29 AM »
Just to clarify, there's no way that you can really make money with 10 seaters right? Even if you're profiting in the simple sense, the additional marketing cost of all those silly little routes would just destroy you, right? Hey Sami, if you get around to reading this, can't we peg the cost of route marketing to the size of the route? For some of these small routes, you could market them by just knocking on the doors of the 100 people that actually live near the airport that I'm flying my 10-seater into... how much would that really cost?  ;)

Offline Maarten Otto

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2010, 09:47:52 AM »
30 pax planes are the bottom limit to run a profitable airline. If you have 50 Embrear 120 for example you will have 2 million a month at most. And that is with low fuel prices and a special marketing strategy to get at least 85% LF.

Biggest problem for a small regional airline is the extream number of staff required. This should be cut by atleast 50%

R.uben

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2010, 03:28:39 PM »
I have a regional airline in marseille

most of my planes have around 40 pax capacity

I'd say, if you have a lot of airports around (like you have in europe) with a demand of 60 for example, you are able to run a profitable airline. I'm actually making profit at the moment, and with marketing of 18000 a week i can maintain my image around 50. Which is very decent i believe with a fleet of 3 aircraft (3 on order right now as well)

I do see that its getting harder now the competition is kicking in and taking lots of my % but Im still the only one on the majority of the routes i started out with so I'd say, its possible, but do not expect to become big in no time. Especially when you buy aircraft it takes a lot of time obviously. But startin out with 1,5 million it is very easy to lease loads of aircraft. I mean a convair 240, 440 is a decent aircraft with a range of 800 nm and can hold 40 passengers with a low fuel consumption. And the 4 months of lease you have to pay before is around 90000 per aircraft. so you can start out with 17 aircraft.

But the smaller routes are saturated quite quickly so I'd say you would not need 17 :P

Offline TK1244

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Re: Regional Airlines in Jet Age
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2010, 03:44:00 PM »
Now operating my 13th F27 Friendship, loadfactor is between 49 and 78% and I'm still profitable on routes with competition. Good marketing and price management will result in a profitable regional airline.
Just try it out at your own base.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2010, 03:50:44 PM by TK1244 »
TK Regional

 

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